| cladamw | wpwrak, hi yes, the version of board-m1/r4/m1.pro we have in git is the same as mine locally. | 03:43 |
|---|---|---|
| Action: xiangfu make the jtag detect slx9 success. with 10 wires connect. 6 jtag pins(Vref, GND, other 4 wires), one ACCINT, one ACCAUX, one GND, one VCCO_2. | 12:12 | |
| larsc | yeay! | 12:21 |
| wolfspraul | xiangfu: wow, congrats! | 12:28 |
| xiangfu | I broken one slx9 chip. maybe because 1. short pins? 2. too hot when I soldering it. | 12:29 |
| wolfspraul | right, either one | 12:29 |
| wolfspraul | depending on how you do the manual soldering the heat is a big problem | 12:29 |
| wolfspraul | as a ballpark number you can say after 3-4 manual resolderings at most almost every chip will have some damage | 12:30 |
| wolfspraul | just ballpark | 12:30 |
| xiangfu | I have one question about 'Chip Temperature Ranges', it says: 0°C to +85°C , but when we soldering the chip under SMT factory. the machine should be around ~200°C | 12:30 |
| wolfspraul | because you don't control the temperature exactly, how hot it is, how the heat spreads, etc. | 12:30 |
| wolfspraul | well sure | 12:30 |
| wolfspraul | that's what I'm saying, there are many subtleties with the heat | 12:31 |
| xiangfu | (manual soldering the heat is a big problem) yes. | 12:31 |
| wolfspraul | 85 is a normal operating temperature still, I guess | 12:31 |
| wolfspraul | no shortening of average life expectancy etc. | 12:31 |
| wolfspraul | an smt reflow profile can be 245 or more degrees, 260, 265 | 12:31 |
| wolfspraul | but then it's exactly controlled how it's heating up there, how many seconds it stays there, how it's cooling down, etc. | 12:31 |
| wolfspraul | and a difference of 5 degrees may impact the yield a lot! | 12:32 |
| wolfspraul | even 2 degrees, depending on chips etc. | 12:32 |
| xiangfu | ~260. yes. but that machine don't damage the chip. | 12:32 |
| wolfspraul | well | 12:32 |
| wolfspraul | heat is heat | 12:32 |
| xiangfu | ok. I just saw your messages. | 12:32 |
| wolfspraul | no 'machine' will do anything to change physics | 12:32 |
| wolfspraul | but with your manual iron, it's a mess | 12:32 |
| xiangfu | ok. | 12:33 |
| wolfspraul | it's more like throwing rocks at a glass installation | 12:33 |
| wolfspraul | totally not well controlled, bad heating up, bad cooling down | 12:33 |
| wolfspraul | it's a mess, so very stressful to the chip (in general) | 12:33 |
| wolfspraul | azonenberg seems to be quite successful with home-made 'reflow ovens' in the form of simple toaster ovens | 12:34 |
| xiangfu | yes. | 12:34 |
| wolfspraul | but even that will take a lot of time to get working, and then you can improve more and more | 12:34 |
| wolfspraul | with 10 usd chips, you are better off burning through some of them manually | 12:34 |
| wolfspraul | anyway those jtag news sound like a great first step! | 12:35 |
| wolfspraul | keep that as a gold sample and make a 2nd board right away | 12:35 |
| wolfspraul | otherwise you risk going in circles and driving yourself mad :-) | 12:35 |
| xiangfu | :-) | 12:35 |
| wolfspraul | when soldering a whole chip, you can try to warm up the board and maybe chip on it a little with a hot air gun | 12:40 |
| wolfspraul | warm it to 80-100 degrees, something like that | 12:40 |
| xiangfu | good idea. | 12:40 |
| wolfspraul | that way the gap from there to the soldering temperature and back is not so abrupt | 12:40 |
| wolfspraul | and all parts can safely be operated at 80 degrees anyway, so that pre-warming will definitely not cause damage | 12:41 |
| wolfspraul | but it reduces stress from sudden heat increase | 12:41 |
| wolfspraul | but whatever you do, with a manual setup you cannot match a well controlled reflow oven and profile | 12:41 |
| wolfspraul | so think economical :-) | 12:42 |
| wolfspraul | do you use leaded or lead-free solder? | 12:42 |
| wolfspraul | I think for manual soldering you can always just use leaded solder, no? | 12:42 |
| wolfspraul | that makes it a lot easier | 12:42 |
| xiangfu | what is 'leaded solder'? | 12:42 |
| wolfspraul | high lead content | 12:43 |
| wolfspraul | nowadays all commercial mass-manufactured products try to be lead-free and use lead-free solder | 12:43 |
| wolfspraul | but lead-free solder has a substantially higher melting temp | 12:43 |
| wolfspraul | you can find more info on wikipedia | 12:43 |
| wolfspraul | you probably use leaded solder... | 12:43 |
| wolfspraul | just checking what could make your life easier | 12:44 |
| xiangfu | 'lead-free' I just don't know this English word. | 12:44 |
| xiangfu | there are 'solder' on the premade PCB. | 12:45 |
| xiangfu | I don't use any more solder. just heat up the PCB solder and PIN. then they are connect. | 12:45 |
| xiangfu | but I have to use 'liquid flux'. | 12:46 |
| xiangfu | without those 'liquid flux'. it just not working. | 12:46 |
| wolfspraul | sure | 12:47 |
| wolfspraul | most likely that solder is leaded | 12:47 |
| wolfspraul | forget about lead vs. no-lead | 12:47 |
| wolfspraul | maybe the air gun can help improve yield | 12:47 |
| wolfspraul | heat up pcb + chip before soldering | 12:47 |
| wolfspraul | but not too much :-) | 12:47 |
| wolfspraul | maybe pcb from bottom is best | 12:47 |
| xiangfu | and I have to use a different iron tip. | 12:52 |
| xiangfu | the one that ship with SMD re-work station not working either. | 12:52 |
| wolfspraul | oh well | 12:53 |
| wolfspraul | good that you quickly try others | 12:53 |
| kristianpaul | xiangfu: nice ! | 14:35 |
| kristianpaul | o cara ! | 14:40 |
| kristianpaul | oi wpwrak :) | 14:40 |
| wpwrak | heya ! | 14:42 |
| xiangfu | I saw the capacity write '50v 4,7uF'. so the MAX voltage is 50v, is there a minimal voltage for capacity? | 15:43 |
| xiangfu | I bought a bag of different capacity and resistor. but they are not for SMT. means very big. so in theory, they are should be same function on PCB. only different size and different composition. | 15:47 |
| wpwrak | xiangfu: no, there's no minimum voltage. it's safe to use them at 0.0 V ;-) | 15:49 |
| xiangfu | wpwrak, thanks. 0.0v :) | 15:50 |
| xiangfu | wpwrak, another question. I bought a AMS1117 , it's convert 5v to 1.2v. without this 4.7uF capacity, it give ~2.0v. after soldering a 4.7uF capacity. the voltage goes to 1.2v. why is that? (I am learning...) | 15:51 |
| azonenberg | wolfspraul: I use SAC305 lead-free and have no real problems with it | 17:22 |
| mwalle | wpwrak: blubb :) | 20:08 |
| mwalle | anybody using a text based email client? | 20:40 |
| wpwrak | of course. mutt rulez ! | 20:41 |
| mwalle | do you have some kind of kill thread feature? | 20:41 |
| mwalle | wpwrak: do we need bits protection bits for user and kernel mode? | 20:51 |
| kristianpaul | mutt rule indeed :-) | 20:51 |
| kristianpaul | yes | 20:51 |
| kristianpaul | ah thread.. | 20:51 |
| kristianpaul | shift +d but it ask for a keyword, perhaps the thread keyword? :) | 20:52 |
| kristianpaul | ^D delete-thread Hmm | 20:52 |
| mwalle | kristianpaul: kill thread would move all furute message for that thread too | 20:53 |
| --- Fri Jul 27 2012 | 00:00 | |
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