#milkymist IRC log for Wednesday, 2011-09-07

wpwrakxiangfu: i've structured the description of that boot process a little bit: http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/wernermisc/source/tree/master/m1/jtag-boot/README00:59
xiangfuwpwrak, great. thanks.01:00
qi-botThe build was successfull, see images here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/build-milkymist/milkymist-openwrt.minimal-09072011-0229/01:25
xiangfuwpwrak, my m1 can not boot again. I am reading the standby.bin back now.02:49
wolfspraulxiangfu: ha :-) you bricked it, broke it? tested to death?02:53
xiangfuwolfspraul, no. just normal use. the last thing I do is test werner new 'boot.bit'.02:54
wolfspraulok02:54
xiangfuread standby 3 times. http://pastebin.com/6khEnJZ803:00
wolfspraulxiangfu: your standby got modified? was it locked?03:01
xiangfuwolfspraul, I can not make sure if it locked. since I test 'reflash_m1.sh' a lot.03:02
wolfspraulok03:02
wolfspraulwell you can also keep it unlocked, since if there is a write bug somewhere that is 'masked' by locking, it's better if you see it so we have a chance to track it down (the write bug)03:02
GitHub192[scripts] xiangfu pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/5h6rag03:40
GitHub192[scripts/master] compile-flickernoise, use full path for MILKYMIST_GIT_DIR - Xiangfu Liu03:40
GitHub30[flickernoise] xiangfu pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/Numakw04:14
GitHub30[flickernoise/master] flash.sh make parameters more flexible - Xiangfu Liu04:14
GitHub110[flickernoise] xiangfu pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/GlgyWQ04:19
GitHub110[flickernoise/master] Makefile: add flash, it will flash both rescue and regular partitions - Xiangfu Liu04:19
GitHub98[flickernoise] xiangfu pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/ia35xQ04:22
GitHub98[flickernoise/master] .gitignore: add TAGS - Xiangfu Liu04:22
wpwrakxiangfu: (can't boot) hmm, with jtag-boot ? did it work before ?05:22
xiangfuwpwrak, no. not relate to jtag-boot. it's just the (write bug) I think.05:28
wpwrakxiangfu: can you run the CRC check ?05:28
xiangfuwpwrak, I am not sure what command I have executed. I recently test a lot reflash.05:28
wpwrakxiangfu: and can you please download your standby partition via JTAG ?05:28
xiangfuwpwrak, too bad. I reflash my m1. :(05:28
xiangfuwpwrak, standby.bin yes. I have download 3 times.05:29
xiangfuwpwrak, they are all same.05:29
wpwrakmy M1 is now in its 669th power cycles and still seems to be healthy. so if you really were able to reproduce the NOR corruption, then i envy you :)05:30
wpwrak(reflash) ah, so it's already gone. pity :-(05:30
xiangfuthe diff is here: http://pastebin.com/6khEnJZ805:30
wpwrak(download standby) did you download (= read) it before or after reflashing ?05:30
wpwrakah, great. checking ...05:31
xiangfubefore05:31
wpwrakah yes, the usual single-word NOR corruption05:31
wpwraknow ... what exactly did you do in the session before it happened ?05:32
xiangfuI last command I remember is tested the jtag-boot yesterday night.05:32
xiangfubefore that I leave the m1 for ~40 hours05:33
xiangfubefore the 40 hours I think I test reflash_m1.sh a lot05:33
xiangfuwpwrak, what should I do when I meet the NOR corruption next time? 1. check CRC 2. read standby.bin 5 times 3. ?05:34
wpwrakwhen you tested jtag-boot, were you doing a regular boot (through standby) before or after ?05:34
wpwrakxiangfu: yes, reading standby.bin and running the CRC check to see if there's damage in other partitions as well05:35
wpwrakxiangfu: also, record what happened since the last time the M1 booted (through standby)05:36
wpwrakwas your standby partition locked ?05:36
xiangfuwpwrak, no. I am not doing regular boot either before nor after. what I do is: plug the m1 power cable, test jtag-boot three times(I am not wait m1 to rendering, just saw some output from serial console then jtag-boot again), 3, I just un-plug the power cable05:36
xiangfuwpwrak, (locked) cann't remember that. test reflash_m1.sh a lot.05:37
wpwrakokay. so you did ... 1) some things yesterday, including a lot of reflashing; 2) booted M1 regularly and left it running for ~40 hours; 3) while still with the same ~40 hours uptime, reboot via jtag-boot three times; 4) powered down over the night/morning; 5) when trying to power up, it didn't start. is this correct ?05:40
xiangfu2) not booted m1. just leave m1 there without power for ~40 hours05:42
wpwrakah, i see05:42
wpwrakso at 3), you powered up and rebooted via jtag-boot. before jtag-boot, did you see if the LEDs were normal for standby ?05:44
wpwrakoh, nice. i have a standby failure, too :)05:51
wpwrakhow do i read back standby.bin ?05:52
xiangfuwpwrak, (LEDs) didn't notice that. but great. you got the failure.05:52
xiangfuwpwrak,  https://raw.github.com/milkymist/scripts/master/scripts/reflash_m1.sh05:53
xiangfuwpwrak, then reflash_m1.sh --read-flash05:53
xiangfuit will download fjmem.bit automatic05:54
wpwrakthanks ! nice :) it's reading ...05:54
xiangfuit will output the read back standby.bin path when finish read05:54
xiangfu~700 power cycles you finally get the failure.05:56
xiangfuvery aggressive :D05:56
wpwrakyeah. took some 12 hours. glad i didn't have to press any buttons ;-)05:56
wpwrakaw: do you still remember what you usually did before you got those NOR corruptions ? i.e.,did you usually boot into flickernoise and see the M1 render ? or did you just go to the test software or the rtems shell ?05:59
awwpwrak, when got NOR corruptions, most that I was testing "rendering test", i.e., repeatedly following steps:06:02
aw1. power on06:03
aw2. press middle btn06:03
aw3. waiting for rendering led is fully on06:04
aw4. once monitor screen shows up video effect then start to count 30s06:04
wpwrakaw: what did the M1 render at that time ?06:04
aw5. power off06:04
awbe noticed that duration is roughly 3 ~ 5 seconds between step 1 and step 506:05
awwpwrak, what?06:06
awit's rendering that screen shows video effect.06:07
aw"what did the M1 render at that time ?"  --> what you wanted to say?06:08
wpwrak3-5 seconds from 1 to 5 ? or from 5 to 1 ?06:08
awfrom 5 to 106:08
ThihiObviously 5->1 since 4 has 30 seconds wait06:08
wpwrakwhich patch did it show when rendering ? the fullscreen camera (the default setting) ? or something else ?06:08
wpwrakThihi: just checking ;-)06:08
awwpwrak, just the first patch video effect(default setting), I don't try to press SW1 to go next patch.06:10
wpwrakaw: great, thanks !06:11
Thihiwpwrak, yeah, better safe than ...06:12
awif later you see 'dimly lit' on D2/D3 after power-cycled, then you get probably the err you want. ;-)06:12
wpwraknice. at least i got a double failure for all my insistence: http://pastebin.com/eLSUa1HZ06:12
awwow...double06:13
wpwraki hadn't checked the status for some ~150 cycles, though. so they probably developed in successive runs.06:14
wpwraknow, how do i run the CRC check ?06:14
awwpwrak, how many channels on your scope? maybe a six-channels to see 'power up/down ramp'?06:15
wpwrakaw: (six channels) yeah, i wish ;-))06:15
wpwrakaw: i have a lousy 2 analog channels, just like you06:15
awwpwrak, did you install 'flterm' already?06:16
awwpwrak, ha..i see06:16
wpwraki don't know flterm.  i just used good old neocon06:16
wpwrak(for the serial console. maybe flterm can do more than that, though ?)06:17
awwpwrak, good question, but i don't know them.06:17
awsecond06:17
awtest image: imagehttp://milkymist.org/updates/current/for-rc3/boot.4e53273.bin06:17
awcommands: $ flterm --port /dev/ttyUSB0 --kernel boot.4e53273.bin06:18
awxiangfu, can you point wpwrak that how to install 'flterm'?06:18
wpwrakah yes, i see that flterm has some extra features. building ...06:18
awxiangfu, i meant that the link of flterm server06:19
awwpwrak, aha...great06:19
xiangfuflterm is under "https://github.com/milkymist/milkymist/tree/master/tools"06:20
wpwraki'm just cloning git://github.com/milkymist/milkymist. then i have everything :)06:21
xiangfuyes06:21
xiangfuyou needs clang installed06:21
wpwrakfor flterm ?06:22
wpwraknaw, compiles flawlessly with gcc ;-)06:23
xiangfuwpwrak, I got a error when use gcc "flterm.c:36:17: fatal error: sfl.h: No such file or directory" so I just install clang :)06:26
wpwrakyou forgot the -I. ;-)06:27
wpwrak frame.payload[0] = (current_address & 0xff000000) >> 24;06:29
wpwraksomeone's very afraid ;)06:30
wpwrakok, flterm is running.  i'm at the rtems shell. is this normal so far ? how do i start the crc check ?06:33
xiangfuwpwrak, no. you should not boot to rtems.06:34
xiangfuwpwrak, when BIOS is start, keep press 'ESC' in flterm. goto the BIOS console.06:34
wpwrakah, good. i'm there06:35
xiangfuthe flterm command should like "flterm --port /dev/ttyUSB0 --kernel boot.4e53273.bin"06:35
xiangfuthen input 'serialboot'06:35
wpwrakyes, that's what i have06:35
wpwrakaah, nice06:35
wpwrakvery good. only standby,fpg has a CRC error06:36
xiangfuafter boot to test image. the first 'a' is for CRC06:36
xiangfudefinitely  :-)06:36
xiangfuI mean it should be.06:37
wpwraknaw, we don't really know yet what's going on. but i'm glad only standby got hit06:39
wpwrakby the way, the link to fjmem.bin.bz2 on http://milkymist.org/wiki/index.php?title=Flashing_the_Milkymist_One#download_fjmem is wrong06:48
wpwraknot sure what the "official" location should be. http://milkymist.org/updates/2011-07-13/for-rc3/fjmem.bit ? sounds a little temporary06:49
xiangfuhttp://milkymist.org/updates/fjmem.bit.bz206:51
wpwrakin fact, the whole http://milkymist.org/msd/ doesn't exist anymore (it's referenced elsewhere on that page)06:51
xiangfuI am use "http://milkymist.org/updates/2011-07-13/for-rc3/fjmem.bit" in reflash_m1.sh, there is no fjmem.bit.bz2 at that time.06:52
wolfspraulxiangfu: I don't understand 'for-rc3' either06:52
wolfspraulwhat is that?06:52
wolfspraulI would think our releases are binary compatible with rc2 and rc3?06:52
xiangfuthose files only needed by factory release.06:53
xiangfufactory reflash I mean06:54
wpwrakinteresting .. reflashed standby and it still doesn't want to configure. let's see what happened ...06:54
xiangfuwpwrak, after reflash, sometimes needs re plug the power cable.06:59
wpwrakyes, i did that (via labsw). i didn't to the eraseflash, maybe that's the problem. anyway, i'm downloading the standby partition, so i'll see in a moment what's wrong07:03
wpwrakoh, cute. it's byte-swapped ;-))07:07
wpwrakdid i miss then "endian" command ... ?07:08
wpwrakhmm, apparently07:09
wpwraklet's do it again then07:09
xiangfu'endian big'07:09
xiangfuin jtag batch file07:09
wpwrakyeah. must somehow missed it in copy & paste07:11
wpwrakstandby is up again. victory ! :)07:12
xiangfu( http://milkymist.org/wiki/index.php?title=Flashing_the_Milkymist_One#download_fjmem is wrong) fixed07:14
wpwrakthanks ! both links in  http://milkymist.org/wiki/index.php?title=Flashing_the_Milkymist_One#pre-compile_images  are broken, too07:16
xiangfufixed :)07:17
wpwrakkewl. thanks ! the 2nd one would have been hard to guess :)07:18
xiangfuthe 'reflash_m1.sh' support it. all you need to is './reflash_m1.sh --snapshot milkymist-firmware-09072011-0325'07:20
xiangfu:)07:20
wpwrakheh :) reflash_m1.sh does a bit too many things for these experiments :) i prefer the low-level commands, so i see what i'm doing. e.g., i want full control over the locking07:21
xiangfuyes. sure.07:23
xiangfuthe latest milkymist source code not working. I have tried the build all images today. after boot to flickernoise, the screen keep black. and rtems shell also dead. :(07:24
xiangfuI am try to write the pre-compile patches source code.07:24
xiangfuI will use CRC result as the compiled patches file name. like Lekernel - FullScreen Video-in Preview.fnp.87c1d21007:26
xiangfusince the rtems already support crc07:26
wpwraksounds good. and crc is fast :)07:31
wpwraki also wonder if the first patch shown shouldn't be something other than the camera fullscreen. if you don't have the camera connected (or if it doesn't work), you just get a blue screen. not a nice welcome.07:32
xiangfumaybe there is one options in patch files in future, like "require_videoin" , if no camera connect, just skip the patch.07:35
xiangfuok. Ralf finally merger the small patch to upstream. let's test a little.07:43
GitHub185[scripts] xiangfu pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/aKzK-w07:46
GitHub185[scripts/master] compile-lm32-rtems: update gcc patch, rtems upstream merged hardware divider patch - Xiangfu Liu07:46
lekernelxiangfu, you can simply check if the patch sets the video_a variable08:09
lekernelthis requires some messing up in fpvm though... but i'll need to refactor that part of the code to support more variables anyway08:10
lekernelso just wait for now08:10
xiangfuchecking now08:11
xiangfuwithout any patches installed. flickernoise works fine. now copy some patches to m1.08:15
lekernelxiangfu, btw, you are using git head + rtems cvs?08:19
lekernelbtw,  everything rtems is merged upstream now08:19
lekernelit should "just work" except for the "lag" bug I mentioned08:20
lekernelwpwrak, I wonder if the bug is also able to unlock flash sectors...?08:27
xiangfulekernel, I use all GITs under github../milkymist/...08:27
lekernelxiangfu, ok. i'll probably remove the "rtems" repository at some point - there are issues (like zlib) with git-cvs, everything is upstream atm, and there's no immediate need for large RTEMS patching08:28
wpwraklekernel: good question. for now, i'm trying to make it happen a little more quickly. two hits in 12 hours is a bit slow ...08:36
wpwraklekernel: xiangfu had a corruption today too, but doesn't know if he had the NOR locked at the time or not08:37
xiangfulekernel, when I start one patch(Illusion & Che - The Piper.fnp) the rtems shell will stop working. after exit the rendering mode. the flickernoise became very very slow like some thread take 100% cpu, and the [performance] windows keep display "Compiling patches..."08:50
lekernelxiangfu, yes, this is the lag bug08:50
lekernelit triggers when you render a patch, or use the variable monitor or video input preview08:51
lekernelit appeared when updating RTEMS08:51
xiangfuis there a patch for it ?08:51
lekernelno08:51
lekernelI don't know what's happening. maybe some IRQ handling fuckup - the LM32 code was totally broken in the latest RTEMS version, even a "hello world" wouldn't work08:52
lekernelI fixed it a bit and now Flickernoise can boot, but obviously there are more bugs08:53
lekernelit can be a FN bug though (race condition or such), which is simply uncovered by a different behaviour of the new RTEMS version ...08:53
xiangfu'Power off' and 'Reboot' buttons not working.08:58
xiangfu'shutdown' command in rtems shell not working, but 'halt' works fine08:58
xiangfunot working mean make system hang. have to press all three buttons for reset08:59
lekernelafter the lag bug manifested itself, or every time?08:59
xiangfueverytime. what I do is:   boot to m1 --> click 'reboot' in flickernoise --> then system hang09:00
lekernelok09:00
lekernelthere has been major changes in that part of the code09:00
lekernellet me find the rtems pr again09:01
lekernelhttps://www.rtems.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=182409:01
lekernelI remember testing it though...09:02
xiangfuwhen click the 'Power off' and "reboot" buttons, only flickernoise hang. the rtems shell still work.09:04
xiangfuinput 'shutdown' in rtems shell. the shell hang. the flickernoise just like meet the lag bug09:05
lekernelah, this one is interesting09:05
lekernelrtems_shutdown_executive() already took a uint32_t as a parameter.  This value is now stored in CPU0's idle task return status09:06
xiangfusomething wrong inside "rtems_shutdown_executive"09:06
lekernelmaybe the LM32 port does some tricks with the idle task return status09:06
lekernelwhich could explain both bugs09:06
xiangfugoogling 'lm32 idle task return status' :)09:08
lekernelbtw, I used GDB during the lag bug, and it seems the CPU spends lots of time in the idle task09:09
lekernelsounds like a scheduler wreck09:09
wpwraknewflash: after about 600-700 quick cycles (power cut while rtems is still booting), standby its unhappy. and indeed, there's a single-word corruption: http://pastebin.com/VmDPzDkL12:05
wpwrakchecking the other partitions ...12:05
rohnand always has corruption. thats why one has to use ecc and badblocks.. or did i miss something?12:06
lekernelit's nor12:07
rohwell.. then we know it should be error free on buying it. but it also will degrade. not that fast and hard, but i guess some ecc isnt a bad idea12:07
lekernelthis is incredibly annoying. had you locked the sector that had the corruption?12:07
lekerneland is it still locked now?12:08
wpwrakagain, only standby.fpg is affected12:08
rohlekernel: agreed. flash is purely annoying12:08
wpwrakno, i didn't try locking yet. first, i want to narrow down how to make it happen.12:09
lekernelah, ok :-)12:09
wpwrakbut i guess i can give it a run with locking for a while. this time it tool only ~4 hours before it struck.12:10
wpwraks/tool/took/12:10
lekernelbtw, if you erase the flickernoise partition, the BIOS will report a boot error and stay there12:10
lekernelthen, if you still get corruption, it means it's not a flickernoise/rtems bug12:10
wpwrakhehe, that would help against being slow with Esc ;-)12:10
wpwrakah, i see12:11
wpwrakby the way, the message "I: Press Q or ESC to abort boot" seems to be misleading. at least on serial, "q" doesn't seem to have any effect. Esc works as expected, though.12:11
lekernelit's a capital Q12:11
wpwrakyou bastard ;-)12:12
wpwrakindeed12:12
wpwrakmaybe say "Shift+Q" ? after all, i don't have an "ESC" key either. just "Esc" :)12:13
kristianpaullekernel: had you done something with milkymist + osc from puredata?12:29
lekernelno12:29
kristianpaulI'm a stub in puredata but i posibly will demo milkymist this october 28 to some local media*lab people12:30
kristianpaulokay, so arduino and midi should be enought to start.. and a simple osc client i guess12:30
kristianpaulbtw for your arduino workshop what are you connecting to the arduino to interact with people?12:34
kristianpaulI mean some push buttons, light sensors?12:35
kristianpauli still dont see a clear use for and arduino and milkymist for VJing..12:36
lekernelyou can send OSC from puredata directly into the M1 via the local ethernet network12:36
kristianpaul(directly) yes i'm aware of that12:36
lekernelit's not exactly for vjing, it's for more general performances... there's a small community of people who like to have all sorts of sensors on stage :-)12:37
kristianpaulhe, may be some big keyboard interfaced with arduino to the milkymist12:37
kristianpaulso people can jump and modify running patch :)12:37
kristianpaullekernel: (sensors) got it :-)12:37
kristianpaulAnyway thats good, people feel better if can do soemthing arduino* most of the time12:38
kristianpaulgotta go read you later !12:38
awrc3 case assembly status:12:45
aw1. so far now assembled 9 sets, some of them were shipped out. Five sets are packed for sale, one is in rendering test for one hour.12:48
aw2. here will continue to assemble the rest12:48
aw3. two problems of 'clean' issue I met now: you can check the pictures folder here: http://downloads.qi-hardware.com/people/adam/m1/pic/case_assembly/12:49
rohah. nice. how did you get the shield so nice and clean?12:52
rohi tried using high-percentage alcohol (ethanol) to get rid of the spots12:53
aw3.1 one is clean for shielding-sheet, the incoming parts are not always good surface on metal side, so I have to use liquid composed of "Surfactant" elements : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surfactant12:53
awa liquid of that I can get from normal cleaner-kitchen-used to clean it.12:54
aw3.2 the other one is "bits and small pieces" after tearing off films, you can see those pictures shown up.12:56
rohsure. thats normal. but much better than lasering without film (which means one gets a lot of ugly residue from the lasering itself12:56
awall the acrylic side case I have to clean it with a 3M tape:12:56
awi used this : http://www.nexcare.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/NANexcare/Nexcare/Products/?PC_7_RJH9U5230G8BD0IUC4S6IE3O33_nid=BXF7LJJQT2be0GMR7RRQNHgl12:57
rohlooks like its intended to hold bandages together12:58
wpwrakroh: by the way, is there also acrylic that's not "clear as glass" ? maybe a bit of milkiness could make the whole thing less sensitive to fingerprints and such12:59
awi tried to use normal tape in reel, then the acrylic surface will be adhered that normal tape's glue which things get worse.12:59
awi also tried to use our official "Qi- Cleaner" item 07: http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/File:06-accessories.JPG13:00
awalso things won't be get better.13:00
wpwrak"official qi cleaner" is smell a branding opportunity ;-))13:01
rohwpwrak: of course. you can basically get all colors. its just 'paint' ;)13:01
awso far now I ONLY use 3M tape to absorb those irritating clean jobs but just will take me a lot of time to do every set. phew~13:01
rohwell.. inside the acryllic. mixed into the transparent13:01
awso everytime before I cover all side-case, I have to clean all inside surface of case13:02
awand after assembly then clean/absorb outside surface.13:03
wpwrakaw: have you considered an ultrasound bath ? not sure if it would be good at removing the lasered remains, but it worked quite nicely for removing the more obnoxious dust in my milled FR4 boards13:04
wpwrakthere's a cheap CC one that may be big enough ... googling ...13:05
wpwrakerr, "cheap" is redundant ;-)13:05
awso those "bits and small pieces" are residual of <Frictional force-oriented, Coherency and static electricity>.13:05
awwpwrak, good thinking13:06
wpwrakthis guy: http://emtrading.en.made-in-china.com/product/peEnAbJuFDhr/China-Ultrasonic-Cleaner-2-5L-CE-Mark-.html13:06
awbut I've still have no suitable ideas for current goal13:06
rohso maybe a electric cloth could help?13:07
rohi mean.. one thats non-isolating to break up the static which keeps the protective foil on. or how does that work?13:08
awroh, yup...possible, also a good idea13:08
awi was thinking to use air blow from compressor for it13:09
awbut didn't do it since this will messy my room though. also not good idea13:09
wpwrakaw: you may be able to find this kind of ultrasonic cleaner at your electronics mall. you'd have to bring a M1 front or bottom plate to check the size, though, since the specifications can't be quite trusted13:10
awroh, yes, i just need to find an electric cloth.13:10
awwpwrak, agreed13:10
wpwrakaw: (this device is even available in argentina. alas, it's probably too rough for electronics. so i bought a different model that is smaller and has less power)13:10
awso i just posted here and tired to know if there's quick and easy way i can use. ;-)13:11
rohnot really. i use fingernails and a clean cloth to wipe it afterwards13:13
wpwrakaw: i think you need to experiment a bit. one problem is that the surface scratches easily. otherwise, you could use something like this: http://www.transtools.co.uk/store/prod_4302/geologist-tools/estwing-erc/7c-geologist-rock-chisel-wide-with-rubber-grip-and-striking-cap.html13:14
awwpwrak, yup...i'm search web here firstly13:15
wpwrakif an ultrasound bath works, that would be the most convenient solution. you just put the stuff in the bath and let the machine work for a few minutes while you have a beer ;-) what i don't know is if the ultrasound bath would be strong enough to remove these residues.13:16
awwpwrak, so you always use ultrasound bath to remove the more obnoxious dust in all your milled FR4 boards?13:18
rohi dont believe so. also you would need to single out parts. if they touch inside the bath they would scratch13:18
roh-> food.13:18
awwhat's it inside your ultrasound bath's lumen?13:20
wpwrakroh: you could probably separate them with something rubberish. i wouldn't worry about scratching. the force is very gentle. but if you put them on each other, the liquid couldn't reach everwhere13:21
wpwrakaw: volumen ? hmm, mine has about 1 l, i think. checking ...13:21
awi used 3M since I believe its elements won't scratch glass surface also no residaul.13:21
wpwrak(my ultrasound) it's less. about 0.5-0.6 l. mine would be too small for the M1 boards. i bought it for electronics, mainly for flux removal13:23
wpwraki tried it for removing milling residues the first time for the labsw face plate. and it worked quite well. of course, the water is now full of little FR4 dustballs, so i'd drain it before doing electronics again.13:24
awso for flux and dust while milling FR4 boards....sounds good but not sure if can remove my status, since the dust after lasered process.13:25
wpwrakyes, i honestly don't know whether it would work for M1 or not13:25
awhm...water13:25
wpwraki cleaned mine manually. didn't think of putting it in the ultrasound13:26
wpwrak(water) or you can also use other liquids if you want. e.g., alcohol. be just tap water should be sufficient in this case. for electronics, i use de-mineralized water (car supplies), to avoid adding salts13:27
wpwraks/be //13:31
awhttp://www.codyson.com.tw/products.html   here have alot, just need to know if can solve my condition.13:33
awwpwrak, no on alcohol. ;-) i tried my old rc2 case which is bad. also if using alcohol, needs to use very softy cleaner like Qi, but still scratch a little. :(13:34
awmm... de-mineralized water.13:36
wpwrak"The requested URL /english/index.php was not found on this server." grrr :)13:36
GitHub97[rtems-yaffs2] sebhub pushed 1 new commit to master: https://github.com/milkymist/rtems-yaffs2/commit/33cc35a0d49fef709e697670c37841cbd49a07fb13:36
GitHub97[rtems-yaffs2/master] Moved memory management. - Sebastian Huber13:36
wpwrakbut the descriptions are mostly english anyway. nice13:37
awwpwrak, yes13:38
wpwrakaw: for this kind of work, you'd want to have one with a lot of power. ultrasonic cleaning is used for many things and the devices vary in their specialization. for example, it's used for cleaning fuel injectors for cars and such. some of those cleaners have a lot of power.13:39
GitHub19[rtems-yaffs2] sebhub pushed 1 new commit to master: https://github.com/milkymist/rtems-yaffs2/commit/05a982c0f544a0ff32092307253240fa73126f8a13:39
GitHub19[rtems-yaffs2/master] Avoid NULL pointer access. - Sebastian Huber13:39
wpwrakaw: for electronics, you want very little power. plus, you want to vary the frequency, so that you don't accidently hit the resonant frequency of any chip, and damage it.13:39
awwpwrak, yes, need to study such product more13:40
awwhat frequency you're using now?13:41
awi meant for FR4 pcb dust/flux goal. :)13:41
wpwrakmine has constant frequency but it's relatively weak. so it's a compromise. it's not idea for electronics, but i hope it won't mistreat them too badly. the problem is that the "nice" ones with variable frequency are hard to get here in argentina. they exist, but what i found costs about 3-4x as much as one of the simpler models, and i didn't want to spend a lot on my first experiments with ultrasound.13:43
wpwraklemme check the frequency ...13:43
awoah~ sure the first equipment you tried, get a lower cost product firstly13:44
wpwrak45 kHz. it's this one: http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-120943940-lavadora-de-ultrasonido-40-w-industria-argentina-_JM13:45
wpwrakabout USD 15013:45
GitHub86[rtems-yaffs2] sebhub pushed 1 new commit to master: https://github.com/milkymist/rtems-yaffs2/commit/5e960a990b062988ce2fb1dc883baff2292c618e13:46
GitHub86[rtems-yaffs2/master] Implemented data synchronization. - Sebastian Huber13:46
awwpwrak, okay..thanks, btw i have to study more and ask vendor. ;-)13:47
wpwraklet's hope they can help you. having to manually clean up all these cases sounds rather nasty :)13:49
GitHub8[rtems-yaffs2] sebhub pushed 1 new commit to master: https://github.com/milkymist/rtems-yaffs2/commit/2def83667b99c3f196a030687e69ea6470400ec413:49
GitHub8[rtems-yaffs2/master] Check the device read-only property during mount. - Sebastian Huber13:49
awwpwrak, yes, really nasty and unproductive. :(13:51
awroh, thanks for your electric-oriented cloth idea, need to check/ask. ;-)13:55
rohno clue if it works13:56
wpwrakaw: i think for the next production run, you should invite wolfgang and jon to visit you. then they can help with all this nasty stuff :)13:59
awroh, just need to try/work out but not now though. ;-)14:01
awwpwrak, ;-)14:01
awthanks guys, good night.14:02
wpwrakroh: maybe you can ask the laser-cutting fab what they recommend.14:03
rohthey cut without foil and ignore teh residue14:06
rohbut it looks ugly then and foggy14:06
wpwrakmaybe they know what other customers do, if there are any others who prefer to have the foil14:07
GitHub119[rtems-yaffs2] sebhub pushed 1 new commit to master: https://github.com/milkymist/rtems-yaffs2/commit/6c4875892e2710a9ff106136d469850cd0ced8ca14:25
GitHub119[rtems-yaffs2/master] Changed seek mechanic. - Sebastian Huber14:25
qi-botThe build was successfull, see images here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/build-milkymist/milkymist-openwrt.minimal-09072011-1542/14:38
GitHub73[rtems-yaffs2] sebhub pushed 1 new commit to master: https://github.com/milkymist/rtems-yaffs2/commit/6b598375456932c774c4ac64dd802e8e3e73234314:57
GitHub73[rtems-yaffs2/master] Use UNIX time instead of seconds since boot. - Sebastian Huber14:57
rohwpwrak: i think i was the biggest of their customers yet. mostly they only do small stuff, art etc15:02
rohwpwrak: http://lokolo.eu/15:02
wpwrakroh: oh, i see :)15:18
kristianpaulroh: nice link !!17:00
Action: kristianpaul like lamp s a LOT17:00
rohkristianpaul: check out http://opendesigncity.de/ .. a more commercial place that raumfahrtagentur.org but they have quite some lamp-enthusiasts17:18
lekernelwhat's lamp? linux apache php mysql?17:29
larsc:D17:33
larsci think they talk about the kind of lamp that emits light17:33
kristianpaul:)17:41
kristianpaulyup17:41
wpwrakwith locking, 11112 cycles without trouble so far. encouraging.18:03
wpwrakoops, typo. only 1112. still not quite twice the number of cycles i needed until a certain first failure before.18:09
wpwraki'll let it run until 2000 or such18:10
lekernelhttp://www.milkymist.org/leaflets/brochure_v4.pdf22:16
wpwrakwhee, looks cool !22:45
wpwrakbtw, standby still looks good after ~1800-2000 cycles. (there's a bug in labsw that makes it miss some cycles)22:50
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