#qi-hardware IRC log for Saturday, 2012-05-12

kristianpauli will wolfspraul 00:21
wolfspraulgreat, thanks00:22
kristianpaulbtw i still got Forbidden for m1 not found for gps00:23
wolfspraulbecause I just deleted everything and rebuilding now00:23
kristianpaulok ok00:23
wolfspraulforbidden or 404?00:23
wolfspraulwhich url is not working right now, and what is the error?00:23
kristianpaulboard-m1 forbidden00:24
kristianpaulm1-gps-expansion 404, but i guess because just one commit so far :)00:24
wolfspraulboard-m1 is currently being rebuilt00:25
wolfspraulthere is no index.html yet so the end result is forbidden00:25
wolfspraulm1-gps hasn't started yet, so it's 40400:25
wolfspraulno, there is 1 nice page in m1-gps, you will see later :-)00:25
kristianpaulwow how long it take to rebuild?00:25
wolfsprauldon't know00:26
wolfspraula few hours?00:26
wolfspraul1 hr?00:26
wolfsprauldon't know00:26
wolfspraulI just deleted everything and it will rebuild everything00:26
wolfspraulnormally it only adds incrementally on top00:26
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: schhist/schhist2web: correctly align shared columns (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/eda-tools/d8f5c9501:09
wolfspraulalright, all schematics histories rebuilt02:33
wolfspraulplease let me now if anyone spots a problem still02:34
wolfspraulroh: a little while back you were asking about easier entry points, PDF02:35
wolfspraulhere is the overview now http://projects.qi-hardware.com/schhist/board-m1/02:35
wolfsprauland the link to a complete latest schematics PDF is always this one http://projects.qi-hardware.com/schhist/board-m1/pdf_m1.pdf02:36
wolfspraul(which is auto-rebuilt after commits)02:36
wolfspraullemme see how clean it looks :-)02:36
wolfspraulwow, nice02:38
wolfspraulwpwrak cladamw - congrats!02:38
wolfspraula few things I noticed - would be nice if the first page overview had hyperlinks to the individual schematics pages02:38
wolfspraulalso, the entire file has no mentioning of license whatsoever, it should mention cc-by-sa somewhere, just to give people confidence02:39
wolfspraulor whatever license we think this falls under02:39
wolfspraulwithout any copyright or license info, a lot of people will assume there is some hook somewhere02:39
wpwrakthe compliments are all adam's - he did all the hard work. i was just heckling :)02:40
wpwrak(c) good point02:40
wpwrak(links) hmm. very tricky.02:41
wolfspraulI cannot search text (like FLASH_A9), strange02:41
wolfspraulhyperlinks between wires would also be nice02:41
wolfspraulthere is no index02:41
wpwrakthere's worse. the PDF isn't searchable (kicad doesn't produce the tags and there is nothing postscript would recognize as text in the file)02:42
wolfsprauleven though the PDF has 19 tidy pages, it's only 1.3 MB - great02:42
wolfspraulyes, not searchable - just noticed02:42
wpwrak(not searchable) yup :)02:42
wolfsprauland no hyperlinks between wires either02:42
wpwrakthat would be nice too, yes02:42
wolfspraulok, but copyright and license should be added02:42
wolfspraulfirst step02:43
wpwrakthough, perhaps that needs more than just simple links. e.g., if there are multiple peers, where do you go ?02:43
wolfspraulthe searchability and hyperlinks probably need to be improved in kicad, I would think?02:43
wpwrakyrd, that's easy02:43
wpwrakyup. they need some serious kicad work02:43
wpwrakat some point in time we may also want to fix those bloody arcs. i thought they had done this years ago, but no ...02:44
wolfspraulthe individual pages have no title whatsoever, so you may initially be confused about which page you are on02:44
wpwrakalso one of my minor gripes02:45
wolfspraulunless that is our secret trick to get people to *memorize* the overview faster :-)02:45
wolfspraulso yeah, I think that's it at first glance02:45
wpwrakactually, in the PDF generated by schhist it's a major gripe :)02:45
wolfspraullicense, searchability, hyperlinks, titles, index02:46
wpwrakthe ones i print have the sheet name in that little box. hard to read, though02:46
wolfspraulyeah that box is ugly, not sure what is better - nothing or that standard box02:46
wolfspraulthe license should be there, right on the first page ideally02:47
wolfsprauland some THANKS mentioning all contributors02:47
wpwrakindex .. i get one (PDF index)02:47
wolfspraulI mean a listing of all pins/wires02:48
wpwrak(THANKS better have a link to a page with more data. or just the repository. replicated THANKS lists rot even faster than commented-out code ;-)02:48
wolfspraulmaking it searchable would help a lot02:48
wpwrak(index) oh, i see.02:49
wolfspraulI think the PDF is the major entry point for anyone looking at the schematics02:49
wpwrakat some point, it's better to just use eeschema02:49
wolfspraulso I would still repeat the attributions (thanks) on the first page, yes. it's important to highlight our culture and values.02:50
wpwrakso i'd leave out the really deep stuff02:50
wolfspraul95% or more will never move past the PDF stage02:50
wpwraka agree on general searching, though02:50
wpwrak(highlight culture and values) not sure. those credits lose meaning quickly once a project goes beyond a very small number of people. it's still good to record who contributed, but it doesn't really need to take up space on the front page (figuratively speaking)02:54
wpwrakthe record would be more for confirming someone's claims of having participated in a project. of course, the role would still be difficult to assess without much deeper examination02:55
wpwrakso that's for a) providing credentials to people who don't know you or your work, and b) legal battles (e.g., to prove that you're a copyright holder)02:56
wpwraka lot of b) is already covered by commit logs and commit policies. we don't have the latter, but we're also tiny with a flat hierarchy, so this matters less02:57
wolfspraulnothing better than THANKS, the more the merrier03:04
wolfsprauland I wouldn't even make one fuss about who is who. it's a different level. someone who reported a typo back is listed together with someone who may have contribute an entire new subsystem.03:05
wolfspraulit's about expressing the culture of collaboration, nothing more03:05
wolfspraul(or less :-))03:05
wolfsprauljust a pretty obvious question to ask now that the PDF is just 'bare metal', so to speak03:06
wolfspraulmakes me wonder who the people are03:06
wpwrakhmm. i don't think it works this way :) but the people who need to find that credits file, wherever it may be, tend to find it ..03:50
LunaVoraxGood morning everyone!07:39
wolfspraulgood morning10:49
virichola kristianpaul 13:26
viricxiangfu: one question about chinese13:26
viricxiangfu: many sites have the simplified/traditional chinese options. Do people write manually in both, or computer programs can map one into the other?13:27
wolfspraul>95% of chinese are learning and more comfortable with simplified13:29
wolfspraulare learning = 'have learned' at some point in their lives13:30
viricbut I mean... can a computer map between simplified and traditional?13:30
viricor it requires manual work?13:30
wolfspraul>95% of websites are equally simplified, and people write simplified, and read simplified13:30
wolfspraulcomputer can map, but it's not 100%, maybe a little better or similar to google translate going from, say, spanish to english :-)13:31
viricah ok13:31
wolfspraulmaybe a little better, but there are still lots of ambiguities. google translate is probably pretty good at it13:31
wolfspraulbut that's a non-issue really13:31
wolfspraulno need13:31
viricIt's not like... types to handwriting13:31
wolfspraulthe only 2 very small regions that are 'native' in traditional are hong kong and taiwan13:31
wolfspraulso that's what 8 + 25 million?13:31
wolfspraulbut simplified is more like 1.3 billion or so13:31
wolfspraulso in hong kong and taiwan, it's all traditional, in the rest simplified13:32
viricyes I knew13:32
wolfspraulI don't think many sites have both actually13:32
wolfspraulmaybe sites in HK and Taiwan do :-)13:32
viriccan be13:33
wolfspraulmost mainland sites I know of don't bother much with traditional13:33
viricI find that most I've seen (by chance - I don't go to chinese sites at will) have the options13:33
viricso, both traditional and simplified are each written manually, on websites showing both13:33
wolfspraulin my personal opinion, they should have gone further and straight to an alphabet13:33
viricyes, like koreans13:34
wolfspraulbut that revolutionary chance has passed (there were such plans and efforts, but revolutions caused too much pain already and nobody really nobody wants to get back to this stuff now)13:34
viricwolfspraul: when they get an alphabet, maybe they'll have better mapping between sounds and letters, not disasters like English or French.13:35
wolfspraulit won't happen anyway13:35
wolfspraulI am getting happier with chrome and auto-translation by the day13:36
viricI thought you were more of open source13:36
wolfsprauland that is not?13:36
viricwhere is the translator?13:37
wolfspraulplus relax, if you get me started you will never hear the stopping of ranting about foss anymore :-)13:37
virichaha :)13:37
wolfspraulI think I already have to be careful with my constant "get an iphone if you want a good phone" advice... :-)13:37
viricthis week, I tried to get two people show me how they get a QR code with their super phones13:38
wolfspraulI actually, until you raised it, never thought for one second about the fact that google translate is, oh my god, indeed, a CLOSED SaaS!13:38
viricboth failed13:38
wolfspraulOH MY GOD13:38
wolfspraulI will slap on my back for a while now13:38
viricwolfspraul: well done! :)13:38
wolfspraulhow could I not have noticed?13:38
wolfspraulI just don't care maybe?13:38
wolfspraulit just works?13:38
wolfsprauloh my13:38
viricyou should stop using things that just work ;)13:38
viricIf it works, it's a trap13:38
wolfspraulpick foss, and you will never worry about anything else anymore13:39
wolfspraulH AHA13:39
wolfspraulok I hold myself back now13:39
wolfspraulnot to taint this beautiful channel :-)13:39
GNUtoo-desktophttp://www.apertium.org/index.php?id=translatetext <- not a closed SaaS but doesn't support chinese....13:45
viricapertium only works between close languages13:46
GNUtoo-desktopah ok13:46
viricby design13:46
wolfspraulcan firefox integrate this so I can just right-click on stuff to translate?13:46
wolfspraulanyway it's a good link - thanks! learning new things, never heard about apertium...13:47
Action: kristianpaul hides13:47
viricI've a friend working at it13:47
kristianpaulsigh, i have to two steps to get apertium translate from english to spanish..13:48
wpwrakkristianpaul: i see english -> spanish there13:49
kristianpaulthats new to me >:)13:50
wpwrakand it even seems to work :) it's pick about orthography, though13:50
viricthe best should be catalan related and esperanto :)13:52
kristianpauli was to say that 13:52
kristianpaulah, yes, spanish -> english is beta13:53
qi-bot[commit] Paul Cercueil: MIPS: JZ4740: SLCD: Toggle TV-out through /sys instead of ioctl. (jz-3.3) http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/6068b0519:05
qi-bot[commit] Paul Cercueil: MIPS: JZ4740: SLCD: lock the console before blanking on TV-out. (jz-3.3) http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/589e55919:05
Jay7is it just merge from upstream?19:07
Jay7or for some real Qi-HW device?19:07
Aylathe SLCD driver is used only for the dingoo a32019:08
whitequarkI just rewrote irclogger from scratch23:00
whitequarkit shouldn't suck as much anymore23:00
wpwrakthe log collector ? or the presentation ?23:04
whitequarkthe presentation was fine, whereas collector randomly died23:05
whitequarkI added several quick hacks to it and nothing has changed, so now I rewrote it on a much better IRC library23:06
whitequarkand solved a TODO item which lasted for months23:06
wpwrakah, i see23:06
wpwrakoh, that's not an unusual age for TODO items. in fact, it's easy for such things to become immortal ;-)23:07
DocScrutinizer*sigh* true23:30
--- Sun May 13 201200:00

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.9.2 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!