| kristianpaul | morning | 01:24 |
|---|---|---|
| zrafa | kristianpaul: you are not in morning :) | 02:46 |
| zrafa | kristianpaul: or yes? Maybe you just started your day? | 02:47 |
| kristianpaul | zrafa: he just following the regard :) | 02:48 |
| kristianpaul | no no mmorning | 02:48 |
| kristianpaul | btw the cheapestway to send a package to AR is 35usd | 02:50 |
| kristianpaul | max 1KG | 02:50 |
| kristianpaul | but no tracking no nothing | 02:50 |
| kristianpaul | and 30day deliver | 02:50 |
| kristianpaul | EMS costs around 47usd | 02:50 |
| kristianpaul | s/regard/greeting | 02:51 |
| zrafa | kristianpaul: ah.. thanks for the information :) | 02:53 |
| kristianpaul | EMS take 6 days to arriv | 02:54 |
| kristianpaul | e | 02:54 |
| wpwrak | fedex from digi-key: USD 40 | 02:55 |
| wpwrak | takes about 30 hours to arrive at customs. then another 30 hours to clear them :-( | 02:56 |
| kristianpaul | and pay $$$$$$$ ? | 02:56 |
| wpwrak | yeah, that too | 02:56 |
| Action: kristianpaul sigh | 02:56 | |
| wpwrak | indeed | 02:56 |
| kristianpaul | about cheap, well if it is less that 100gr (considering 40gr of packaging) it will be 26usd :/ | 03:00 |
| kristianpaul | and is expensive considering i got from US 15usd air mail shipping.. for jeenodes board/kit the other time | 03:01 |
| kristianpaul | okay this time should work, ratio get down from 150 to 33 ;) | 03:13 |
| qi-bot | [commit] Xiangfu Liu: icarus-miner: record time on u.log and export to webserver ROUTER_IP/u.log (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/ed8a0b7 | 03:27 |
| qi-bot | [commit] Xiangfu Liu: cgminer: make it compile. only enable the bitforce FPGA support (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/f65d64c | 03:27 |
| qi-bot | [commit] Xiangfu Liu: cgminer: add libpthread libncurses jansson to DEPENDS (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/83c6a66 | 03:27 |
| kristianpaul | ah nice, 8 minutes, wonder how slow it will ;) | 03:30 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: yes, air mail is even less. but also takes longer. | 03:33 |
| qi-bot | [commit] Xiangfu Liu: cgminer: enable-cpumining for play (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/e114a4e | 03:40 |
| Action: kristianpaul trying to setup minet.py | 04:07 | |
| wpwrak | wolfspra1l: hmm, on https://sharism.cc/ the "Sharism Presents Milkymist" looks a bit odd, because it's placed like a title for everything, including the Ben | 04:07 |
| wolfspra1l | he | 04:08 |
| kristianpaul | and soon at ben/usb ! | 04:09 |
| wolfspra1l | agree, on the todo list somewhere for 'the big cleanup' | 04:09 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: yeah ! :) | 04:09 |
| kristianpaul | a name in a webpafe tittle is not that big ;) | 04:09 |
| kristianpaul | webpage* | 04:09 |
| wpwrak | wolfspra1l: btw, someone asked if you also got tuxbrain's UBBs ? | 04:10 |
| wpwrak | of course, it's rather easy to make them yourself ;) | 04:10 |
| wolfspra1l | did not, forgot actually | 04:10 |
| wolfspra1l | one by one | 04:10 |
| wolfspra1l | I don't even have the atben/atusb yet | 04:11 |
| kristianpaul | i bet tuxbrain is using UBBs with its arduinos | 04:11 |
| wpwrak | (one by one) sure, just wondering | 04:12 |
| kristianpaul | xiangfu: RPC getwork error | 04:14 |
| kristianpaul | souns familiar to you? | 04:14 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, yes. :) | 04:21 |
| kristianpaul | xiangfu: what does mean? | 04:22 |
| kristianpaul | i already create minin worker account.. | 04:22 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, it maybe missing python files. or something wrong with your account. | 04:22 |
| kristianpaul | ah FYI i'm fpgaminer core on the M1 board | 04:22 |
| kristianpaul | hmm | 04:23 |
| xiangfu | no. it not react the FPGA yet. | 04:24 |
| xiangfu | I mean it must be something with the python script file or network. | 04:24 |
| kristianpaul | i need confirm fpga works ok, had you dont this before? | 04:25 |
| kristianpaul | i dont need minining yet.. | 04:25 |
| xiangfu | for confirm what you needs send some data to fpga. wait let me found the detail. | 04:25 |
| kristianpaul | i'm using this https://github.com/progranism/Open-Source-FPGA-Bitcoin-Miner/blob/master/projects/Verilog_Xilinx_Port/sources/software/miner.py | 04:25 |
| xiangfu | yes. | 04:26 |
| wpwrak | running fpgaminer in some unused corner of the fpga may actually be a nice gag. "M1 pays for itself" ;-) | 04:27 |
| kristianpaul | yeah ;) | 04:27 |
| kristianpaul | but fpgas dont have unused corners at least not that shape i bet.. | 04:28 |
| wpwrak | what kind of bitcoin production could we expect with M1 ? anything significant ? like the equivalent of USD 1-2 per day ? | 04:28 |
| kristianpaul | or usable shape | 04:28 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: dont know | 04:28 |
| wpwrak | (unused corner) why ? couldn't you have some bitcoin-mining device in M1 ? | 04:29 |
| kristianpaul | yes | 04:30 |
| kristianpaul | i already have it | 04:30 |
| kristianpaul | but not sharing resources with the SoC itself yet.. | 04:30 |
| wpwrak | ah, i see. so you run it instead of the SoC | 04:30 |
| kristianpaul | so i would not place in the corner | 04:31 |
| kristianpaul | yes wpwrak | 04:31 |
| kristianpaul | for now :) | 04:31 |
| kristianpaul | i need to know if it is alive.. | 04:31 |
| wpwrak | yeah. so you still need to find a nice corner for it :) | 04:31 |
| kristianpaul | exactly ;) | 04:31 |
| kristianpaul | xiangfu: have a payload example? | 04:32 |
| wpwrak | in terms of resource usage, in the configuration you've synthesized, does it use nearly 100% of the FPGA ? or a smaller fraction ? | 04:32 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, send '33c5bf5751ec7f7e056443b5aee3800331432c83f404d9de38b94ecbf907b92d' to fpga | 04:33 |
| xiangfu | it should return you '063c5e01' immediately | 04:33 |
| kristianpaul | xiangfu: had you tested it already? | 04:33 |
| kristianpaul | ok let see | 04:34 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, sorry what you mean payload? | 04:34 |
| kristianpaul | no problem, you already seems provide one :) | 04:34 |
| wolfspraul | wpwrak: at most 10-20 cents / day ;-) | 04:34 |
| kristianpaul | wolfspraul: you should not said it that to him :D | 04:35 |
| wolfspraul | the reason I work with ng (the designer of the open Icarus board) a little is that if we are lucky, we can share some designs and bits and pieces of tech with him | 04:35 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: free dailly candy ! | 04:35 |
| wolfspraul | for example his board uses a 12V power supply, and boots from SPI | 04:35 |
| wpwrak | aii .. so it won't pay for itself in less than ... ~9 years | 04:36 |
| wolfspraul | and I'm sure he would design a new one around artix-7 the moment he can get hold of one | 04:36 |
| wolfspraul | bitcoin mining is extremely competitive, like unleashing a storm when people sense money, I guess ;-) | 04:36 |
| wolfspraul | but Icarus is a nice design and all files are open and I will see whether there are missing pieces etc. and hopefully ng keeps his stuff open in the future | 04:37 |
| wolfspraul | just another one of those experimental activities like the led power supply (and others before that ;-)) | 04:37 |
| wpwrak | (competitive) yet another gold rush :) | 04:37 |
| kristianpaul | xiangfu: how do you send it and wait from imediate reply? | 04:41 |
| kristianpaul | argh no reply.. | 04:43 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: bitrush | 04:44 |
| wpwrak | bitcrush :) | 04:49 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, try this one: d29b709fbce49b83ed9d404f38c2341330083eea5b344650e7f7ce1575fb5c33d4a8d866c832353f1ebaa88e00000000 | 04:51 |
| xiangfu | you have to decode them to hex | 04:51 |
| xiangfu | then send to fpga. | 04:51 |
| xiangfu | it should reply 063c5e01 | 04:51 |
| kristianpaul | send, just copy and paste on the terminal? | 04:51 |
| xiangfu | checkout the line 68 of miner.py | 04:53 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, no. that is not real hex. | 04:53 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, echo d29b709fbce49b83ed9d404f38c2341330083eea5b344650e7f7ce1575fb5c33d4a8d866c832353f1ebaa88e00000000 | xxd -r -p is the real hex | 04:55 |
| xiangfu | maybe cat `echo d29b709fbce49b83ed9d404f38c2341330083eea5b344650e7f7ce1575fb5c33d4a8d866c832353f1ebaa88e00000000 | xxd -r -p` > /dev/ttyUSB0 | 04:55 |
| xiangfu | then cat /dev/ttyUSB0 | xxd -p | 04:56 |
| wpwrak | i would call that "binary" | 04:56 |
| xiangfu | kristianpaul, I maybe wrong again. needs check more about line 68 of miner.py :) but test it first. :) back online later. | 05:01 |
| Action: kristianpaul zzzzz | 05:06 | |
| cladamwa | (AMPEN/GPD4) Does anyone know that if set this pin high will let NN with speaker out under there's no earphone plugging ? correct or no ? | 10:05 |
| cladamwa | as i know even under condition in plugging earphone, then if you pulldown POP/GPB29, you won't hear sound playing on earphone. This should be like this. | 10:11 |
| whitequark | wolfspraul: hi | 11:40 |
| wolfspraul | hi | 11:40 |
| whitequark | how do you think, if I could get a PCB I'd like to be traced and sent it to you | 11:41 |
| whitequark | could you give it to a PCB fab so they'd trace it? like the picture on the wiki | 11:41 |
| wolfspraul | I suggest you get some sandpaper and do it yourself | 11:43 |
| whitequark | is it so easy? | 11:43 |
| wolfspraul | he | 11:43 |
| wolfspraul | I speak about it without ever having done it with my own hands | 11:43 |
| whitequark | mhm | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | but that's just because there are so many thousands of tasks on my todo list, I haven't gotten to it yet | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | but yes, it is easy | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | use corning 120 to go through the layers, and corning 400 for polishing before scanning | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | two types of sandpaper | 11:44 |
| whitequark | well, there's one thing | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | experiment with some garbage pcbs | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | and then onto the one you care about | 11:44 |
| wolfspraul | I think it mostly has to do with learning how much pressure to use, so you don't accidentally sand through the next layer | 11:45 |
| whitequark | hm, I think you are right | 11:45 |
| whitequark | thanks | 11:45 |
| wolfspraul | but that's worth learning, once in life | 11:45 |
| wolfspraul | also there's a practical problem of how to fix the pcb | 11:45 |
| whitequark | the PCB I may want to be traced is this: http://mobilephonerepairguides.blogspot.com/2011/03/samsung-galaxy-s-4g-pcb-board.html | 11:46 |
| whitequark | I think I may find some dead ones in a local repair shop, if I'd ask them nicely | 11:46 |
| wolfspraul | steve talked about this here http://en.qi-hardware.com/irclogs/qi-hardware_2011-02-21.log.html | 11:46 |
| wolfspraul | so he thinks about 25 minutes per layer, without scanning | 11:47 |
| wolfspraul | most of the time using corning 120 | 11:47 |
| wolfspraul | then 30-50 seconds polishing with corning 400 before scanning | 11:47 |
| whitequark | (fix) this may be easy. I could use a board and some nails, then put the pcb on it so the nail heads would fit into the holes | 11:47 |
| wolfspraul | and he writes "not damaging the board on the borders is hard" | 11:48 |
| wolfspraul | "you should always just remove the copper of one layer until you see the coating of the next layer, otherwise it's hard to tell the copper of 2 layers apart and you may remove too much" | 11:48 |
| wolfspraul | but I think once you went through one or two test pcbs, it should all be clear and easy | 11:48 |
| wolfspraul | for pcbs, sandpaper is the way to go | 11:49 |
| wolfspraul | for an IC, you need something else :-) | 11:49 |
| whitequark | ICs are easier, personally for me | 11:49 |
| whitequark | I could easily get 100% H2SO4 | 11:50 |
| whitequark | and I think I know where I could find a polarizing microscope | 11:50 |
| whitequark | I'd like to take some photos of the baseband chip too | 11:50 |
| wolfspraul | some more tips from steve (see the link) | 11:50 |
| whitequark | I wonder if the GPS in it is a standalone core or actually connected to the modem part | 11:50 |
| whitequark | thanks, I'll read it! | 11:50 |
| wolfspraul | "the best way to prevent damaging the borders is to have some other material with the exact same thickness around the pcb, so you're not damaging the edges (which will become round otherwise)" | 11:51 |
| wolfspraul | and "use a few rows of gaffer-tape as an underlayment, since the non-adhesive side is quite resistant to the sandpaper" | 11:51 |
| wolfspraul | all small mechanical tricks, like I said I am sure after 1-2 pcbs you have your own setup... | 11:52 |
| wolfspraul | and one day I really have to do this myself! | 11:52 |
| wolfspraul | not just talk about it... | 11:52 |
| whitequark | (gaffer-tape) err. I see the pics in wikipedia | 11:52 |
| whitequark | but by dictionary does not know such a word | 11:52 |
| whitequark | and I never seen anything like this in Russia | 11:52 |
| wolfspraul | I think he means the tape you use for wrapping boxes | 11:53 |
| wolfspraul | you find some other way | 11:53 |
| wolfspraul | the edges make sense, otherwise you apply more pressure at the edges naturally (when sanding) | 11:53 |
| wolfspraul | and the pcb has to somehow be fixed | 11:53 |
| wolfspraul | and then - sand sand sand | 11:53 |
| wolfspraul | 25 minutes / layer :-) | 11:53 |
| whitequark | (wrapping boxes) that thin polyester very hard to tear by hand tape? yes, I know this | 11:53 |
| wolfspraul | he just wants to avoid scratching/damaging his desk surface, I think | 11:54 |
| whitequark | ah. makes sense too | 11:54 |
| wolfspraul | a cutting board from the kitchen may do as well | 11:54 |
| wolfspraul | the key 'technology' is the sandpaper | 11:54 |
| wolfspraul | that's what all Chinese places I've seen offering this service will do as well | 11:54 |
| wolfspraul | they just put some kid on sanding through the layers :-) | 11:55 |
| wolfspraul | I guess you could also use more high-tech, but why... | 11:55 |
| whitequark | the chinese way | 11:55 |
| wolfspraul | 8 layers = 4 hours, plus scanning and preparation/cleanup, let's say 6 hours | 11:55 |
| wolfspraul | hourly wage let's be generous 3 USD, so 6*3=18 USD | 11:56 |
| wolfspraul | the boss will ask about 100 USD from me, so 92 for himself, company, overhead, customer service, etc. | 11:56 |
| wolfspraul | :-) | 11:56 |
| wolfspraul | sorry 82 | 11:56 |
| whitequark | mhm. yes, it's more cost effective to do it myself. also, skills. | 11:57 |
| wolfspraul | you don't easily beat the economics with any laser cutter or whatever delamination device you may have | 11:57 |
| whitequark | reversing is fun! now, it's only a question of finding a scrap pcb | 11:58 |
| whitequark | ebay has none, I've checked | 11:58 |
| whitequark | so, my only hope are local repair shops | 11:58 |
| whitequark | thanks again for the info! I'll write how it will go | 11:59 |
| wolfspraul | yes please | 11:59 |
| wolfspraul | I am only relaying words, unfortunately | 12:00 |
| wolfspraul | and I have no time to try this again right now, always an excuse | 12:00 |
| whitequark | I neither. but at the Saturday I'll go and find the board | 12:00 |
| whitequark | weird | 12:04 |
| whitequark | BP and AP are connected via USB | 12:04 |
| whitequark | and the BP is a multi-descriptor device. it has PHONET for control and media (audio) for sound routing | 12:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | wolfspra1l: (fixing PCB) now that's the easy part: just use one can of cyan-acrylic glue and a wooden or glass board | 19:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: nailing the PCB to the support won't fly, the last layer is way to flimsy | 19:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | actually the best approach would be to use two PCB and sand down each one from one side until half the layers are gone, use the other board for the rest of layers, from the other side | 19:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | actually I think that's what they did for the photos on wiki | 19:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | the just mirrored the layers from PCB #2 | 19:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | then* | 19:51 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: thanks for the suggestion | 20:01 |
| whitequark | test | 20:31 |
| whitequark | there's something really FUBAR with IPv6 at this host and my logger bot :/ | 20:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: when doing a PCB teardown to RE the circuit, you may want to take ULTRA-highres scans of each layer, and maybe even manually mark all vias you can find, on each layer | 20:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | vias are most important key part for RE, and most PITA to detect and find on scans/photos | 21:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | I prefer the idea of doing an electrical RE. Apply voltage to one pad, see which other pads also have voltage. I got quite a bunch of weird ideas how to simplify resp automatise that | 21:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | e.g you could do all that under water, use DC, and see where gas bubbles from electrolysis appear on the connected pads | 21:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | on good macro photos you probably can see the bubbles quite easily | 21:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | another possibility: use phenolphtalein or another idicator and see where pH-level of water changes due to electrolysis | 21:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | yet another idea: | 21:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | do the same with high voltage in evacuated gas containment, to build a gas discharge setup where the pads start glowing in the dark | 21:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | or use kirlian (high voltage high frequency) and see the mini tesla-transformer alike sparks and StElms discharge on the pads in plain air | 21:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | or use galvanic effect in liquid, to form a (removable) coating of a clearly colored metal on all the connected pads | 21:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | copper probably not that good on gold pads - silver might work, esp when you convert it to silver-sulfid which is deep black | 21:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | or cover the whole PCB with some low quality varnish (low adhesion, quite some pores) and then use AC to make that varnish pop off on pads where gas micro bubbles build up and vanish every 1/100 second (at 50Hz AC) | 21:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure, it's unclear whether any of those weird ideas will work for those BGA footprints where yo got >2 pads / mm | 21:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | but it's also unclear how wolfspra1l 's equation for expense to do PCB teardown and RE would look like, when we count in the work to actually create a connection plan from those layer photos | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | and then a true semi decent schematics from that connection plan | 21:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | I guess the work for that is like 100 times the work for the sanding down and doing scans/photos | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | err missed a 0, meant thousand times | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe a mix of automated coarse and manual fine analysis/search of pads that are connected may yield good results: use a fine long line carbon brush (kinda similar to those formerly used to clean vinyl records) to spot X and Y coords where to do detail search for a connected pad | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | damn hell FFS, those 0402 footprints are monsters compared to the friggin fine pitch BGA | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe this one helps a bit to get an idea | 21:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/Gallery-N900-exploded/platine_01.jpeg | 21:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's already not good enough to do a proper RE | 21:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | via dents almost invisible | 21:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | when you zoom in so a 0402 footprint is the size of a fingertip, you can guess them via dents | 21:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | at zoom 250% you actually can see most of them, but you also see the artifacts | 21:33 |
| abushcrafterforg | Anyone tried audio editing on the nano note? | 23:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | maybe that's already a little bit too demanding a task for that tiny machine? regarding the missing audiocard, the missing USB hostmode to plug in a audio card dongle, the limited gfx on screen | 23:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | sox might work just fine | 23:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | ;-) | 23:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | though maybe not in realtime | 23:54 |
| --- Sat Feb 11 2012 | 00:00 | |
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