#qi-hardware IRC log for Tuesday, 2012-01-31

whitequarkthat's why everything tastes like chicken...00:03
wpwrakno, that's because there's not enough glutamate on your food ;-))00:13
whitequarkhuh. a truck with 19 ton (sic) of latex gloves was stolen from FSB [a Russian federal security service]00:14
wpwrakdo you worry more about what will happen to them now or more that the FSB needed them in the first place ?00:15
whitequarkI worry more about how to move, like, several thousand kilometers to the southeast00:17
DocScrutinizeragain, I'm not paranoid and I don't feel any discomfort regarding acting the way I do - but the fact some of you now think I'd be paranoid actually is exactly in line with my little game, which makes me smile :-)00:17
Action: whitequark looks up "paranoid" in the dictionary00:18
whitequarkah, got it. you do not suffer from that, you enjoy it00:18
wpwrakwhitequark: africa or australia ?00:20
whitequarkwpwrak: australia00:20
DocScrutinizeryes, I actually enjoy playing games with the "powers that be", and sometimes maybe also with you :-D00:21
whitequarkwpwrak: I'd prefer somewhere closer to Jupiter orbit, but there are no kittens on jupiter. How'd I live without kittens.00:21
DocScrutinizerseems I stated that before00:21
wpwrakwhitequark: ah, any concrete plans (for .au) ?00:21
whitequarkDocScrutinizer: I don't recall, but it's kinda obvious00:21
whitequarkwpwrak: yes. 1) get a university degree00:21
wpwrakwhitequark: (jupiter) maybe with the help of the monoliths ... ?00:21
whitequarkno way witout it00:22
wpwraki see. long-term planning :)00:22
whitequark2) become someone who will be useful enough for a potential employer to pay for relocation00:22
whitequarkand etc.00:22
whitequarkthat's not going to happen within the next few years, which is not surprising, given my age00:22
Action: whitequark looks at DocScrutinizer and shuts up00:23
wpwrak1b) marry into a russian mafia family, so that you get the financial resources for ...00:23
wpwrak2b) conversion into a kangaroo. then you'll pass as native :)00:23
whitequarkgetting away from anything even loosely related to "russian" things (that is, as percieved by people from other countries) is the task 0).00:24
wpwrakah, condemned to a life of denying your origin. and already at such a tender age. how tragic ...00:25
Action: whitequark writes that down to his collection of pathetic English statements00:25
whitequarkyou don't even remotely know how hard it is to write something really pathetic for a foreigner00:26
wpwrakforeigner ?00:26
whitequarkas for language00:26
wpwrakoh, english isn't my first language either00:27
whitequarkhave you ever talked to native speakers? I did not00:27
wpwrakalthough i sometimes fool people. when writing. my accent gives it away, though :)00:27
wpwrak(native speakers) yes, of course00:28
whitequarkI know some people on IRC. mostly on #qi-hw channel. that's it00:28
whitequarkof course I read a lot in English, but that's mostly technical articles00:28
whitequarkwhile there definitely are some quite pathetic phrases, they are not that widespread00:29
wpwrakso your spoken in english will be horrible. well, don't worry :)00:29
whitequarkI think my written english is quite horrible, too00:29
whitequarkspoken is at roughly same degree of horribleness, according to my teacher00:30
wpwraknaw, it's your written english is good00:30
DocScrutinizerstrange enough, on a flight back from TPE the Taiwanese lady seated next to me started some smalltalk with me, and she guessed I must be an American00:30
wpwrak.. while mine visibly declines after dinner with beer :-(00:30
wpwrakDocScrutinizer: must have been the eyes :)00:31
DocScrutinizerhers or mine? :-D00:31
wpwrakDocScrutinizer: hmm. advice for ladies: "don't wear glasses on a date. you'll look better. and he, too."00:32
Action: whitequark has an err... impaired vision he does not know how to measure in this weird american units, but he does not wear any glasses... because he's too lazy to get a pair00:34
wpwrakthen the impairment probably isn't too bad yet00:34
wpwrakand most of the world doesn't use american units :)00:34
whitequarkI don't clearly see 11pt font on 96dpi 15" display00:35
whitequarkthen it's -3 dioptries.00:35
wpwrakmyopia ? astigmatism ?00:35
whitequarkmyopia, yes00:35
wpwrakah, unavoidable for bookish people00:36
wpwrak-3 is significant. if you don't like glasses, you ought to try lenses.00:36
wpwraki suppose you don't drive00:37
whitequarkon the other hand, while I'm unable to recognize people by faces (I think there's a medical condition for that), this way I taught myself to recognize people by figure, style of clothes, voice parameters and, to a lesser degree, walking00:37
whitequarkwpwrak: (bookish) probably, this is a result of using a CRT monitor for ~2 years when I was ~12-14 (don't remember that precisely)00:37
whitequarkat least it stopped to decrease after I switched to LCD00:37
whitequarkyes, I don't drive00:38
whitequarkit does not help you much here in Moscow. traffic jams are more a normal condition here.00:38
wpwrakfunny. might be one of the many shades of the autistic complex (complex = collection of ailments)00:38
whitequarki.e. if it's a day and you don't stay in one, then some disaster happened00:38
wpwrak(myopia) naw, it's not caused by your display. more likely, the progression simply reached its stable point.00:39
whitequark(autistic) yeah, maybe. I'm not that autistic as some of geeks around are (no problems with communication with people I don't know, etc.), but there's something in that version that may be true00:39
whitequark(myopia) that's what everyone except my parents say. I think the truth is out here :D00:40
wpwrakautistic elements in behavioural patterns are strongly correlated with the skills required for the sort of engineering work common in IT. so ... :)00:40
wpwrakyou'll need glasses at university00:42
whitequark(phrase about autistic elements) I don't know if it does sound just as technical and, er, non-smalltalkish in English, but when I pronounce these kinds of verbal patterns, I'm often told that I am a bore :D00:42
wpwrakdistances are too large there to do without them at your correction. you may be able to copy from others for a while but eventually it'll get too cimbersome00:43
whitequark(university) there are problems much worse with that00:43
wpwrakand with lenses being an convenient and affordable option today, it's not much trouble anyway00:43
wpwrak(bore) well, imagine mr. spock at a party, but without the pointy ears :)00:44
wpwraksocial skills can also be emulated. takes a while to learn that, though.00:45
whitequark(university) when I said I need a degree, I meant that I need it for australian's migration service, not much for myself. I don't know if that's just me (everyone I know seem to settle on the same conclusion), but just by taking classes thoroughfully you won't get much knowledge and/or skills useful for your future work. better talk to all of those clever people in the next building, and pass the exams by the usual way students do--of cou00:46
whitequarkshit. ircd. se I mean  working hardly through the entire semester.00:46
wpwrakuniversity teaches you how to learn. it's not so much about the actual knowledge.00:47
wpwrakplus, it may give you some freedom to explore. depends a bit on how they work.00:47
whitequarksometimes the way they try to teach you is just plain wrong00:48
wpwrakoh, sure. but some things will stick nevertheless.00:48
whitequarkwell, that's how I failed math00:48
whitequarkseveral times00:48
wpwrakbesides, you're not motivated to learn most of that they tell you, because you don't have any immediate use00:48
whitequarkmaybe it's not wrong per se -- it may be just unsuitable for me, personally00:49
wpwrakit's part of an experience :)00:49
whitequark(freedom to explore) depends on the university. I was at Bioengineering and Bioinformatics of MSU00:49
whitequarkthat's a not-so-short story00:50
whitequark(and I'm barely able to translate it. I'll try, through)00:50
wpwrak(explore) some run a very school-like shop. lots of exams, etc. that limits what you can do. bioengineering may expose you to enough new things that you won't mind, though.00:51
wpwrakof you take a route that's closer to what you already know, then frequent exams are a nuisance. of course, eventually you learn how to pass them with the minimum amount of preparation, too :)00:52
whitequarkyes, there was a lot of good things, and a lot of things which the teachers didn't care about explaining in a way that you won't need to memorize all of that blindly00:52
whitequarkwhich I just cannot do00:52
whitequarkthat was mostly math. the teachers themselves were really good, and I enjoyed discussing some nontrivial problems with them00:53
whitequarkI think that's just the course which was passed from some higher level braindead department00:54
wpwrakmemorizing things may be a question of structuring them00:54
whitequarkif you have enough information to structure them, yes00:54
whitequarkand not just a heap of facts which are there because you'll need them a year after00:54
wpwrakor relying on short-term memory, before the exams :)00:54
wpwrakno ... structure them such that you can retrieve that information for a few hours. not finding a logical structure. that comes later.00:55
wpwrake.g., learn the night before the exam. repeat things on the bus. then most of it will still be around.00:56
whitequarkwell, anyway. after I got enough of that and also discovered that if I really need that particular part of math for something I'm able to understand better it in 1/10th of time, I decided to quit--bioengineering is defintiely not what I want to "do my entire life" and go to some kind of university where you don't actually need to learn something if you don't want to. i.e. 99% of russian ones (sadly, I think).00:58
whitequarkI'll still try to find one where you have someone to talk to if you actually want to learn.00:58
whitequark(I can still go to MSU if I want.)00:58
wpwrakthere should be someone at most of them00:58
whitequarkyou'd be surprised if you know :(00:59
whitequarkUSSR's education was maybe not perfect, but one of the best in the world. if not best.00:59
wpwraknaw, people may get despondent, but many had some ideals in their past00:59
whitequarkit's destroyed now, almost completely00:59
wpwraksee. so some good people must still be around00:59
whitequarkin all the ways you could imagine00:59
whitequarkI mean01:00
whitequarkin 98% of them you pass the exams by paying enough money01:00
whitequarksomewhere like $100-$150 per one01:00
whitequarkwhether it is possible to pass by having actual knowledge is highly dependent01:01
whitequarkon the particular one01:01
wpwrakah, the joy of privatized education :)01:01
whitequarkit is not01:01
whitequarkat least formally01:01
wpwrakthe miraculous power of bakshish then :)01:02
whitequarkthere's already not enough engineers in the country to run the stuff we already have01:02
whitequarkand, er, most of uni graduates are economists01:03
whitequarkand lawyers01:03
whitequarkand most of the engineers who are staying there are, well, USSR engineers01:03
wpwrakthere must be some parasitologists as well, to keep count :)01:04
whitequarkand they solve the problems in a very USSR way01:04
whitequarkfor example01:04
whitequarkI know a company which makes sonic fish-finders01:04
whitequarkthe head engineer of it cannot read English, but is forced to use western uCs, as there are almost no Soviet ones around01:05
wpwrakin russia, dynamite finds fish ? :)01:05
whitequarkso he just picks the first schematic in the datasheet01:05
whitequarkI mean, seriously01:05
whitequarkhe designs his circuits that way01:05
whitequarkalso, he is afraid of CPUs01:05
whitequarkand he uses russian-made LDOs01:05
whitequarkthey spontaneously fail in ~a month01:05
whitequarkthey not only explode, but also fail short, exploding everything that's after them01:06
whitequarkor there are LCD's (HD44700-like)01:06
wpwraknastrovje ! :)01:06
whitequarkif you pull contrast to the end of its operating range (still within it), they will die01:06
whitequarkthey will also die spontaneously01:07
wpwraka few more years and he'll be gone, too01:07
whitequark"nastrovje"? err... is that a Google Translate error? I don't know such a word01:07
wpwrakof course, his successor will read perfect english but won't understand the chinese data sheets01:07
whitequark(be gone) yes, given the amount of vodka he drinks. and this is not a joke, unfortunately01:07
wpwrak"cheers" in russian ?01:08
whitequarkif I understand what you meant, that would be more "na zdorovje!"01:08
whitequarkand I think you picked up the wrong translation variant anyway :)01:09
wpwrakah, interesting :) it made it as a single word through the iron curtain01:09
wpwrakor maybe from there to the rest of the west01:09
wpwrakat least the not overly educated part of it01:10
whitequarkthat is a toast (not the bread one, you know)01:10
wpwrakyeah :)01:10
wpwraklike "cheers"01:10
whitequarkfor "cheers", my dictionary lists 4 variants: that toast, "congrats" [sarcastically], "thanks" (Brit.), "bye" (Brit.")01:11
whitequarkand I'm not sure if I ever seen the word "cheers" in the wild, so...01:11
whitequarklinguistic issues ftw!01:11
whitequarkmy friend works with that sonar company, because, hm01:13
wpwrakyou use "cheers" when drinking. i also use it as "goodbye" in non-public mails.01:13
whitequarkah ok01:14
whitequarkmost of the stuff they do is so unbelievably stupid that you think it should be some abstract joke01:15
whitequarkthen you realize01:15
whitequarkfor example..01:15
whitequarkthey do not know parameters of their sensors01:15
whitequarkI repeat01:15
whitequarkthey do not know anything. frequency response? sensitivity? nothing.01:16
whitequark1/4 of sensors are dead01:16
whitequarkfor others, a feedback resistor in the device is HAND-MILLED to adjust for sensor's crappiness01:16
whitequarkthey use a Soviet era amplifier chip01:17
whitequarkin DIP401:17
whitequarkand they solder it in SMD-ish way by giving it to students, which manually bend the pins01:17
wpwrakwell, in 10-20 years, they'll have caught up with today's modern technology01:18
whitequarkin 10-20 years they probably all will be dead01:18
wpwrakthen you can dance on their graves. a happy thought :)01:19
whitequarkI could, if they were my competitors01:19
whitequarkbut they're Russia present and future01:19
whitequarkand they are not competitors to anyone01:20
wpwrakyou can still dance on the graves of friends. even though it may be awkward.01:20
whitequarkif there was someone who'd catch up and fix this horrible situation01:21
whitequarkbut anyone trying to do so is actively prevented01:21
wpwrakno competitors ? gee, everybody working alongside without friction, for the greater good of the soviet nation. Brezhnev would be so proud :)01:21
whitequark(Brezhnev) well, he died before I was born, so everything I know about him is his magnificent jacket01:22
whitequarkand if I ask someone older, then I will probably hear an obscenity or two01:23
wpwrakin the west, we certainly thought some obscenities in his general direction01:24
wpwrakof course, we have to credit him for preparing the downfall of the USSR01:24
whitequarkthat was inevitable01:25
wpwrakpossibly. exiting the arms race in time may have prolonged the agony, though01:29
whitequarksigned up for Analog's webinar : http://t.co/RGrW9xlv02:27
whitequarknever seen a webinar before. I wonder how useful it will turn out to be02:28
wpwraki never tried :)02:29
Action: kristianpaul always get late to wemiars02:29
whitequarkoh that will be a problem02:29
whitequarkit's 9AM MSK02:29
wpwrakif it's useful, it'll be good to know it is. if not, as well, of course :)02:30
kristianpauland at lack of interest too :)02:30
whitequark... I will just say one thing. there's a pharmacy in my house. for two months straight, I was not able to come in, as it was "always closed"02:30
whitequarkturned out that it is open 9-2102:30
wpwrak9 am ? in russia, no alarm clocks ? 02:30
whitequarkwpwrak: I am alarm-deficient02:31
whitequarkno matter how hard will you (or some clocky thing) to wake me up, I won't02:31
whitequarkif that'd be a clock which can be turned off, it will be somehow turned off02:31
whitequarkand I probably won't even remember that02:31
wpwrakkeep trying. you'll find one :)02:31
wpwrakcell phones work great02:32
whitequarkif something really fucking serious will be tomorrow, then I'll wake up by myself, with less than minute precision02:32
whitequarkso I figure out that I have very good internal clock02:32
kristianpaulwpwrak: cell phones, indeed !02:33
wpwrakyup, never underestimate the internal clock02:33
whitequarkcell phones do not work02:33
whitequarkthey have an "turn it off" key02:33
kristianpaulactually thats my only excuse to still having one ;-)02:33
kristianpaulother alarm clocks, failed..02:33
whitequarkand this key is not buried deep in the UI like the Facebook account deletion button02:34
whitequarkit should.02:34
wpwrakthe one i had before my current one was about 3x4 cm. when the alarm rand, the sound pressure alone threw you out of bed02:34
whitequarkhow much wall collisions could it stand?02:34
wpwrakmy current one is more gentle. it still wakes me from two rooms away, though02:34
whitequarkthen you're an easy person to awake02:35
whitequarkmost often people fail to wake me up, too02:35
whitequarkI can stand up and say "ok, I'm awake"02:35
wpwrakdo they try water ? :)02:35
whitequarkhalf a hour later I'm mysteriously back in bed and don't remember that02:35
whitequarkand by saying "I don't remember" I mean just that. No memories.02:35
whitequark(water) too much stress for everyday use02:36
wpwrakset you internal clock and you;ll be fine02:36
whitequarkthe problem is02:36
whitequarkit disregards as "nonimportant" everything that is less than, hm02:36
whitequarkwhatever was last time...02:36
wpwrakvodka then. easier to get in russia anyway :) add matches if really necessary02:36
whitequarkI don't quite remember. A long-awaited date? iirc I slept through that.02:37
whitequarkvodka? ahem. how is that supposed to wake me up?02:37
wpwrakmost of the people returning to sleep easily make the mistake of assuming the ones trying to wake up won't try to kill them :)02:37
wpwrakjust as a solvent. and fire accelerator :)02:38
whitequarkactually, it's such a problem that I prefer to stay awake at night (with all the consequences to clearness of mind, yes) if I have something relatively important02:39
whitequarkthen, add coffee02:39
wpwrakask DocScrutinizer about his "rude wakeup call", even without much external help. i think he'll agree that his got his juices flowing :)02:39
whitequarkand redbull02:39
whitequarkmaybe mixed02:39
whitequarkDocScrutinizer: can't wait to hear about that! :D02:40
whitequarkit sounds promising. and scary a bit02:40
wpwrakmaybe connect you alarm clock to a bowl full of animals you resent. worms, spiders, scorpions, whatever02:40
whitequarkis that legal under Geneva convention?02:40
wpwrakit's both :)02:40
whitequarkI think that'd be an easy way for me to stop being afraid of that kind of animals02:41
whitequarkworms? nope, they're just disgusting a bit02:41
wpwrakspiders ?02:42
wpwraksnakes perhaps ?02:42
whitequarkspiders and scorpions? very well maybe, but I doubt that's a good idea, apart from the task of finding a bowl of spiders02:42
whitequarkoh, snaaaakes02:42
whitequarkI love them02:42
wpwrakrats ?02:42
whitequarka snake feels just like a rigid garden hose (those with water). quite a pleasant sensation02:43
whitequarkthey're also muscular02:43
whitequarkyes, like a muscular host02:43
wpwrakliquid nitrogen ?02:43
whitequark(rats) nice little creations02:43
whitequarkthat'd be very one time solution02:44
whitequarkthrough gathering liquid nitrogen isn't much of a problem02:44
whitequarkso I might try that sometimes02:44
wpwraka bowl of boiling nitroglycerine, being slowly titled. so you have to roll out of harm's way quickly enough.02:45
whitequarkdo you know how nitroglycerine works?02:45
wpwrakwithout alarm. so you only warning will be the squeaking of the mechanism tiling the bowl.02:45
whitequarklightly pinch a bowl with a finger. watch your finger flying away.02:45
wpwrakthat's the idea :)02:45
whitequark(squeaking) I'm sometimes much of a perfectionist02:46
whitequarkthat machine won't squiek02:46
whitequarkoh! I know02:46
whitequarkI need a pet shrieker02:46
wpwrakno, that's part of the design. makes sure you subconsciousness won't sleep02:46
wpwrakyeah, get dog. why not02:47
wpwraks/get/get a/02:47
whitequarkno, not that kind of shrieker02:47
wpwrakthose bastards are effective enough, trust me02:47
whitequarkmy neighbors have recently bought a dog02:48
wpwrakhmm. a balrog may get your juices pumping faster, though02:48
whitequarkeach time I open my front door in my flat, it begins to bark02:48
whitequarkcombine with my habit of coming in and out at 3-6AM02:49
whitequarkregistered for that webinar02:52
wpwrak3 hours to go02:52
whitequarkthey've asked me if I'm in Europe and if yes, what's my phone number02:52
whitequarkno, it's on Feb 802:52
whitequarkand btw it's 2 hours to 9 am ::)02:53
whitequarkI provided them my real phone number, just out of curiosity02:53
whitequarkwill I receive some EE SMS spam?02:53
whitequarkif yes, from what country will it originate?..02:53
pabs3whitequark: the data for that Google public transport routing is all public, anyone could download all the indicies and implement routing: https://developers.google.com/transit/gtfs/03:00
whitequarkpabs3: oh, interesting! so Google's not that evil as I thought03:08
whitequarkI wonder if any OSM navigators can read that03:08
pabs3I expect there are some non-public feeds; there are lots of public ones though: https://code.google.com/p/googletransitdatafeed/wiki/PublicFeeds03:09
zrafaI have a hw question. Maybe somebody could give me some help?. I am trying to guess how expensive is to make this arduino board: http://diy4fun.blogspot.com/2009/04/coreduino.html12:33
zrafaThen.. I am checking at digikey the parts12:33
zrafaThe post on the blog does not have the list part. And the author did not give it. But he gave some pictures and pdfs (schematic, layout, final board etc..). So. My first question:12:34
zrafaschematic and layout show a resitor 680. I checked the pictures and it is a resistor on surface. Then I checked digikey.. And I found at least two, but I do not know which of them should be the correct one:12:35
zrafaI found : 12:35
zrafa1- http://search.digikey.com/us/en/products/5-1614884-8/A103233CT-ND/272879312:36
zrafa2- http://search.digikey.com/us/en/products/5-1676481-1/A103120CT-ND/272867712:36
zrafa1 is : RES 680 OHM 1/16W 0.1% 06012:36
zrafasorry.. that was 2- :P. Again : 12:36
zrafa1 is : RES 680 OHM 1/10W 0.1% 080512:36
zrafa2 is : RES 680 OHM 1/16W 0.1% 06012:37
zrafaHow could know which is the correct one. I have some pictures and schematic. No more I guess12:37
zrafa(sorry if this is a little off topic). But coreduino could be a little "open" hardware. No sure anyway :)12:38
jonandzrafa: if you really are into hobby electronics you should buy yourself resistor kits13:39
jonandzrafa: 0603 kits on ebay are pretty cheap13:40
zrafajonand: Ah, okey. But question : how could I know the exact capacitor or oscillator from pics from that blog project example?13:47
jonandzrafa: which cap?13:49
zrafa(if that is a capacitor :) )13:52
jonandc5 is just bulk decoupling13:53
jonandany value will do13:53
zrafaah.. great, thanks 13:54
wpwrakzrafa: you should ask him for the sources. seems that he used kicad. there, you can see what size the components have.15:45
whitequarkthis is some fucking small package: http://www.ixbt.com/news/hard/index.shtml?15/47/3116:15
whitequarkare you curious why Phobos-Grunt has failed? http://top.rbc.ru/society/31/01/2012/635653.shtml16:21
whitequark62% if ICs were indiustrial-grade, not space-grade16:21
larscsomebody wanted to save some money?16:28
wpwrakif you call a mission "grunt", what can you expect ?16:32
zrafawpwrak: I sent him an email16:35
whitequarkwpwrak: Grunt = Soil :D16:40
wpwrakaccording to "dict": "an unskilled or low-ranking soldier or other worker"16:41
wpwrakof course, it may also describe the sound the mission controllers made when the saw it fail16:42
whitequarkwpwrak: Grunt = @C=B = >G20 = Soil16:43
wpwrakah, in russian. maybe the chips they used only spoke english ...16:46
whitequarkwere you expecting a satellite assembled by former USSR engineers to have an English name?16:46
wpwrakwell, you never know :)16:47
whitequarkoh. another pearl from a very russian devboard maker16:50
whitequarkhe does not route hardware SPI ports of ARMs at all, because:16:50
whitequark"why spend them for nothing? you don't have a lot of them anyway"16:50
whitequarkand now he has three unrouted SPIs.16:50
larscif they are former engineers it might explain why the project failed ;)16:50
whitequarkanother one16:51
whitequarkhe has routed M[1..0] pins of FPGA to the address bus of SoC16:52
whitequarkI don't know how does that work in his distro, but it actually does16:52
wpwrakyou're just envious ;-)16:53
whitequarkit's the same one who omits the bypass capacitors on the board when he's short on them16:55
whitequarkand I guess he has designed his extension connector by a coin flip16:56
wpwrakbetter than no design concept at all :)16:58
whitequarkyou don't have to work with these boards16:58
whitequarkand also don't have to listen to someone who has16:58
LunaVoraxHumble Indie Bundle has landed! http://www.humblebundle.com18:15
wpwrakah yes, heard of that. so pathetic, that world of closed source :)18:42
Action: whitequark has ignored wpwrak and bought that.19:17
whitequarkmind you, not every app on this planet must be OSS19:18
Action: jow_laptop likes Osmos19:18
Action: larsc played osmos before it was cool ;)19:32
Action: C-Keen too19:33
Action: jow_laptop didn't know its "cool" already19:33
C-Keenit has been part of a humble bundle several times19:34
jow_laptopyeah, I got it with the first one19:34
jow_laptopor the first one that included it (?) - don't recall19:34
jow_laptopanyway, doesn't change the fact that I still like it :) very relaxing19:35
whitequarkworld of goo is niiice19:54
mthit would be nice if more games would use the open source, closed data model instead of closed source, closed data19:54
mththen you'd can play your games in the future and on other devices, without them having to give everything away19:55
viricwpwrak: I'm with you, about the closed source :)20:19
LunaVoraxwpwrak, mth, I agree with you, but so far, that's one of the first step to bring some games to GNU/Linux. Sources will came after.20:40
LunaVoraxBesides, the Humble Indie Bundle do release the source fot the game they sells sometimes.20:40
viricthere were the loki times20:42
LunaVoraxI said one of because of that yes20:42
viricah ok20:42
LunaVoraxStill I don't think as much people have heard about Loki as people who have heard about the HIB20:43
LunaVoraxThis sadly reminds me a lot of people don't switch to Linux sometimes only because of gaming. Like if freedom was no big deal.20:44
LunaVoraxActually, I went throu a "what's the point" phase at the moment.20:44
mthI originally switched to Linux because it was more stable than Win9x20:45
mthI only started to appreciate open source later20:45
LunaVorax'cause half of my family have Macbooks (and Apple iStuffs) "because it's so easy to use" and I didn't saw myself explaining that it was restrictive technology in front of 5~6 conservative (understand pro-corporate) iFans.20:46
mthOS X is not nearly as restrictive as iOS though20:46
LunaVoraxmth, it was the same for me but it came all at once, I was curious about computers and always tweaking everything.20:46
LunaVoraxmth, it still isn't really that nice20:47
LunaVoraxI'm not a specialist on the subject, but I'm pretty sure it's not super nice about privacy either (I mean collecting datas)20:47
mthI don't think it collects any data unless you tell it so20:48
LunaVoraxBut the main problem of iOS devices imho is that they are designed to be replaced whenever you like it or not20:48
LunaVoraxSince Apple stops to update old devices so you need to buy a new one to get the latest features.20:49
LunaVoraxAnd if you want something else (Android) you got to void the waranty (and yet the Android port isn't really great yet)20:49
mthApple does support their old devices for a longer time than most Android vendors though20:50
mththe main problem I have with iOS is that the user cannot allow additional app stores20:50
LunaVoraxStill that's not really an excuse about the problem20:50
LunaVoraxAlso yeah20:50
mthI mean the "no updates" problem is industry-wide, it's not specific to Apple20:52
mthit is certainly a problem though20:52
LunaVoraxPeople often tend to ridiculize me by saying they live in the future and me in the past for using "old hardware" but stangely, my wallet refuses to live in the future as well :P20:54
mthI understand that manufacturers don't want to support old hardware forever, but they declare it "old" very soon and most of them don't give others the means to provide support instead20:54
viricdo you think apple devices switch off, when told to?20:56
viricyou can't take out the battery :)20:56
DocScrutinizerwell, I heard the modem doesn't (switch off)22:18
larscpowered by nuclear fusion22:38
whitequarkone of the games in the bundle is very acidic.23:06
whitequarkin any of the meanings.23:06
wpwrakacid is good. it etches out pcbs :)23:51
whitequarkthis particular kind of acid has etched the brains of the developers, and now it indeed etches my brain and eyes23:52
whitequarkit's a game where you have a dark background, on which there is freakin bright flickering rgb cube, which is rolling around in an impossible fashion with funky sounds23:53
whitequarkand they have some interesting soundtracks23:53
whitequarkmost of them are quite good, but one, for example, closely represents the sounds which cats often produce in heat23:54
whitequark_very_ closely23:54
whitequarkactually, all of them are quite good.23:54
whitequarkas per the gameplay... at the current moment, I am a small flickering cube which rolls up the vertical surface near a giant cube robot23:55
whitequarkthat describes it quite certainly.23:55
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