| qi-bot | [commit] Xiangfu Liu: new package: listener automatically records when sound is detected (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/f3d79bd | 02:36 |
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| qi-bot | The build was successfull, see images here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/compile-log/openwrt-xburst.full_system-10142011-0131/ | 06:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | zrafa: more like 3 years older than 30: blit 1981, X11 1984 | 13:41 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: thanks a lot for your suggestion about solder mask/silkscreen removal | 21:53 |
| whitequark | I've improved it a bit: if you use a sharp needle, it's easier to not accidentally split some important trace in two | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: sorry I don't actually recall what I suggested and for what | 21:54 |
| whitequark | hmm | 21:55 |
| Action: whitequark looks up the logs | 21:55 | |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: if he used a knife, it was probably me. if he used the dark side of the force, all the credit it yours ;-) | 21:56 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: that suggestion was about removing stuff that covers traces | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | o.O | 21:56 |
| whitequark | whoops | 21:56 |
| whitequark | sorry, that really was Werner | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | aaah | 21:56 |
| whitequark | for some reason I remembered you as the author of the advice... | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, maybe because it is quite probable that you'd get such kind of advice from me | 21:57 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: yep, I've tried with a knife. using needle is more precise, i.e. I do need the solder mask for 8WSON a lot, but please, no pad-covering silkscreen | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'd nevertheless use a small "round" knife and carefully scrape (NOT cut!) soldermask away | 21:58 |
| wpwrak | if you solder manually, it actually doesn't mater all that much. it's the flux that does most of the magic. but yes, silk screen on pads = evil ;-) | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | soldermask on pads == BUG | 22:00 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: yes, flux is very important too, but if I have exposed traces, solder tends to leak to the uncovered places and makes weird surface tension patterns | 22:00 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: that was a $25 extra-cheap prototyping (for 10 10x10cm boards) | 22:00 |
| whitequark | everything except the damned solder mask is great | 22:00 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: when that happens, try thin solder wick. (thin: <= 1 mm wide) | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | for my education: I thought solder mask is the even green coating, while silkscreen is the printing (usually white)? | 22:01 |
| whitequark | and the latter is off by ~0.8mm | 22:01 |
| whitequark | argh, that was a typo | 22:01 |
| whitequark | of course the silkscreen is off | 22:01 |
| whitequark | solder mask, holes, vias and every other thing is perfectly done | 22:01 |
| wpwrak | off by 0.8 mm ? nice ;-) | 22:01 |
| whitequark | yeah | 22:01 |
| whitequark | maybe even 1mm, it varies | 22:01 |
| wpwrak | why not just do their own creative painting instead ? ;-) well, thinking of it, they kinda did :) | 22:02 |
| whitequark | they've also added some internal number on a random place on the board | 22:02 |
| whitequark | I've rechecked: they actually do that for every PCB | 22:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | weird | 22:03 |
| whitequark | http://whitequark.org/blog/2011/10/07/my-first-factory-made-pcbs/ | 22:03 |
| whitequark | as you can see, the printings inside the top connector aren't on gerbers | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: seems they really do "creative painting" then ;-P | 22:03 |
| whitequark | exactly | 22:03 |
| whitequark | but well then, it's $25 and they did it in single day | 22:04 |
| whitequark | I'll rather scratch off some silkscreen from two boards I do rather, for example, pay twice of that, or wait for a week. | 22:05 |
| wpwrak | and then let's count the hours you spent figuring out what exactly they had done ;) | 22:05 |
| wpwrak | if i need quick but unreliable, i do it in my kitchen :) | 22:06 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: I think that was a meaningful experience. sometimes things go wrong anyway, and it's better to know what the hell may happen there instead of trying to figure it up in a hurry on some much more complex and expensive board | 22:06 |
| wpwrak | yeah. you already know where not to go for complex boards :) | 22:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: you do ds+via in your kitchen? respect! | 22:07 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: ds? | 22:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | doublesided | 22:07 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: double-sided yes, vias with a bit of wire. | 22:07 |
| whitequark | that's very impressive, yes | 22:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | wired vias suck :-D | 22:08 |
| whitequark | I am barely able to do a 1-sided board with 12mil traces | 22:08 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: i have a drill and wire combination where the wire stays in place by friction. takes a lot of pain out of the soldering :) | 22:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm | 22:08 |
| whitequark | tried to make them for ~half of a year intermittently, but finally gave up | 22:08 |
| whitequark | it has consumed a whole lot of time with almost no outcome | 22:09 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: maybe you should reconsider your approach to vodka :) | 22:09 |
| whitequark | *facepalm* | 22:09 |
| wpwrak | (-:C | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: I used to use small copper 'nails' which I riveted with a 20g hammer and a bolt then | 22:10 |
| wpwrak | pheew ... | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | final soldering is utterly simple, and almost not needed at all | 22:11 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: anyway, PCBs without any solder mask conflict with my aesthetic feelings | 22:12 |
| wpwrak | same with my wire. i just add solder paste on both sides of the vias, put the wire into the holes, heat, done | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: I'd redesign my silkscreen anyway | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's too tight | 22:12 |
| wpwrak | i can also do it without solder paste, but it helps in difficult situations | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | silkscreen usually isn't that precise | 22:13 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: you've meant my silkscreen, I guess. or not? | 22:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | yep | 22:13 |
| whitequark | that's Eagle's default silkscreen for most of the components. I think I only designed it for IC2 | 22:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm | 22:14 |
| whitequark | (sorry, I'm too stupid to use KiCad or some other FOSS tool) | 22:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | JP1 JP3 and IC1 silkscreen looks errr odd | 22:14 |
| whitequark | ahh yes, also I've made JP2 from scratch, yes | 22:15 |
| whitequark | that's for a very perverted Hirose connector | 22:15 |
| whitequark | the really funny thing is, when I've tried to plug in the LCD, the connectors did not match anyway | 22:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | err is that JP2? I just see JP1 is at the bottom, not next to R3 | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | umm JP4 | 22:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | JP2 looks not all that bad | 22:16 |
| whitequark | pitch is the same, but my one has "blades" (i.e. flat and wide pins), and the one at LCD _almost_ likes my mating part, but it expects small round pins instead, and a bit different keys | 22:16 |
| wpwrak | yeah, a bit tight. but what really screws it up is the HUGE offset. i don't think the rest would be a problem. | 22:17 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: JP3 and JP4 is from Eagle's pinhead library. I think I'll use SparkFun one in the future, it's quite better IIRC | 22:17 |
| whitequark | *are | 22:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | anyway, why print any silkscreen so close to the soldering area at all? allow silkscreen to move a little, like +-1mm | 22:18 |
| wpwrak | except, of course, the absence of thermal relief. you want to fix that before you make the next 10M units ;-) | 22:18 |
| whitequark | I understand it _now_. But that's my first PCB with silkscreen/solder mask, as the title states | 22:18 |
| whitequark | it's not surprising that I screw it up :D | 22:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | e.g. I'd never ponder to print silkscreen in between adjacent pins of a post-connector | 22:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | and what eagle does there feels kinda odd | 22:19 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: do you add all silkscreen on your boards manually? or only the outlines? | 22:19 |
| whitequark | or do you just design all the components from scratch? :) | 22:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | err, I usually only add component label silkscreens, or if I choose to add frames etc for e.g. smt resistors etc then I make sure they have at least 0.5mm clearance to the solder area | 22:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's not exactly unusual for silkscreen printing to be less carefully done than all the other steps of PCB manuf | 22:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | after all silkscreen is not supposed to be any "functional" part of the PCB - it's for mere convenience | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | solder stop mask otoh is usually very accurately done | 22:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | even the paint used has different properties it seems | 22:25 |
| whitequark | I think it's because of different processes, i.e. solder mask is photoresistive too--isn't it?--and silkscreen is done, well, with silkscreen process | 22:27 |
| whitequark | the latter seems much less precise for me | 22:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | yes, exactly | 22:30 |
| whitequark | darn. still does not work :/ | 22:30 |
| whitequark | I wonder why | 22:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's why for silkscreen there's just one mandatory rule: keep clear of soldering pads ;-D | 22:30 |
| whitequark | 10 minutes earlier, EN was effectively isolated by silkscreen. it isn't now... | 22:30 |
| whitequark | ahh of course. it won't work with FB either. | 22:34 |
| whitequark | *without | 22:34 |
| whitequark | its thickness is enough to prevent contact if there's even a small island, less than 0.1x0.1mm | 22:35 |
| whitequark | how do you think, is it enough to place a small (8WSON, it is like a small LGA-8) chip on the pre-tinned (i.e. with a small amount of solder on it) pads and then heat it with hot air and let surface tension do its work | 22:42 |
| whitequark | or should I press it gently on the top to push it to the board? | 22:42 |
| wpwrak | how would you prevent it from getting blown away without pushing a little ? | 22:44 |
| whitequark | hmm | 22:44 |
| wpwrak | and i hit air fails you, you can always fall back to flux + solder + iron | 22:45 |
| whitequark | it doesn't get blown away even on the top air speed of my hot air gun | 22:45 |
| wpwrak | s/hit/hot/ | 22:45 |
| whitequark | I use an RMA flux-gel, that may be the cause | 22:45 |
| wpwrak | (not blown away) lucky you :) | 22:45 |
| wpwrak | okay, RMA is very sticky :) but still ... | 22:45 |
| whitequark | it doesn't get at all, really | 22:46 |
| whitequark | never had that problem | 22:46 |
| whitequark | even with 0603 resistors or 3x3mm cases | 22:46 |
| whitequark | it's our special russian hot air :D | 22:46 |
| wpwrak | hmm. maybe your is just better than mine :) | 22:47 |
| whitequark | mmmkay, still does not work. | 22:48 |
| whitequark | I hate my life. | 22:48 |
| whitequark | I guess when it _looks_ like it's a bit off, it is actually not soldered at all. | 22:48 |
| wpwrak | if you can see a problem, there are probably two others already that you don't ;-) | 22:49 |
| whitequark | ok, I've pushed it to the board. looks like _now_ it _is_ soldered | 22:51 |
| whitequark | so I should cool it down and check... | 22:51 |
| whitequark | (the reason behind me not wanting to push the component is that yesterday I've moved it quite far away from the pads. It's better today by some reason.) | 22:52 |
| wpwrak | three spools each of 0.5 kg of solder later ... ;-) | 22:52 |
| whitequark | I don't add more solder, it isn't needed | 22:53 |
| wpwrak | for pushing, what works best for me are angled tweezers | 22:53 |
| whitequark | and I've used almost no flux, maybe several mm's from the syringe | 22:53 |
| whitequark | (tweezers) yep, I'm using them. they're most convenient for this IMO, too | 22:53 |
| whitequark | (on the other hand, these extra-super-small components are fast to heat too, so they _could_ survive more solder-desolder cycles :) | 22:54 |
| whitequark | fuck yeah. IT WORKS! | 22:55 |
| whitequark | now, the other board. | 22:55 |
| wpwrak | congratulations ! :) | 22:56 |
| whitequark | thanks | 22:56 |
| whitequark | at least, now I understand the implications of using a random TI-component-which-has-right-characteristics and not-looking-up-the-case-in-advance. | 22:57 |
| whitequark | it looked _much_ bigger on my notebook's screen. | 22:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | building dummies helps a lot | 22:58 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: do you mean printing the PCB on paper? | 22:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | even if it's only cardboard or paper | 22:59 |
| wpwrak | (it looked bigger) ;-)))) | 22:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | nah, dummy of e.g. a 0402 component | 22:59 |
| whitequark | hm | 22:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | I constantly fail to figure how small those critters really are | 23:00 |
| wpwrak | building dummies seems hard. printing is easy. also gives you a feeling. although, on paper it always seems more compact than in real life. | 23:00 |
| whitequark | 0402 is slightly less than the distance between tips of my tweezers, so I don't use them | 23:01 |
| whitequark | also, (seriously), it's nowhere to be found in Russia | 23:01 |
| whitequark | i.e. there is one very expensive (and by "very" I mean 10x-50x more expensive than in the right place and/or in something like DigiKey) shop which has them | 23:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | helps for other components as well, esp chips | 23:01 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: you need better tweezers, too :) | 23:02 |
| whitequark | in the places where you can get components by sane price (and I mean radio markets), there are no 0402 ones. 1206, 0805, yes. 0603 -- harder, but still possible. 0402 and less is missing at all. looks like it's not only me having problems with them | 23:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: well at real values of a dozen per penny they will need massive increase in price to make any money on selling them | 23:03 |
| wpwrak | 0402 isn't too hard. but you can't see very well at that size. so you just have to have faith :) | 23:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | when sold in single qty | 23:03 |
| Action: kristianpaul feels bad about his soldering equipement | 23:04 | |
| kristianpaul | I guess 30W is not enought? | 23:04 |
| kristianpaul | Is for this board http://gnss-sdr.ru/media/1/20101001-front_image.jpg | 23:05 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: at market I can buy some regular components (like, for example, 0603 22p ceramics) for ~$0.016 or even less, down to $0.005 if >50 pts | 23:05 |
| kristianpaul | also i dont know how to handle the GPS RF IC, i dont want to damage if i touch it? | 23:05 |
| whitequark | (there are some things like really fat and small ceramics in 0603/uF range, which is still expensive and/or missing, but that's different things) | 23:06 |
| whitequark | and that shop (called Chip & Dip; don't go there if you'll see it) sells them for no less than $0.2 each, regardless of qty | 23:06 |
| whitequark | MAX232 is $10 instead of $1 as it should be, etc. | 23:07 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: do you have inventory of your soldering equiment somwheere? ;^) | 23:07 |
| whitequark | also, they frequently fail at selling the right component, as their consultants are quite stupid. | 23:07 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: hmm, i'm afraid not. it's a collection from all over the place | 23:07 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: seems that digi-key will get your next order soon :) | 23:08 |
| kristianpaul | what i should get? a 90W iron? twexer of course, flux pen .. | 23:08 |
| kristianpaul | twezers* | 23:09 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: radio market for passive components and terraelectronica for ICs are a really good combination, but they don't have everything. when I'm doing something for myself, I try to pick from the components which are in stock in both, when someone asks me to make a board, I just say that they will finally pay for DigiKey order and shipment :) | 23:09 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: a temperature-controlled iron mainly | 23:10 |
| whitequark | (terraelectronica is a company name, of course. they have some _really_ good prices, like selling from qty 1 for the price of 100s) | 23:10 |
| kristianpaul | can i bought that too from digi-key? cause i'm really thinging in make my first big order :) | 23:11 |
| kristianpaul | nv, i can buy that locally i guess :) | 23:11 |
| kristianpaul | what about handling RF ICs, any advice? | 23:11 |
| wolfspraul | good morning | 23:12 |
| whitequark | I'd definitely begin with an antistatic bracelet | 23:12 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: (price from d-k, parts from terra) good idea ;-) | 23:12 |
| kristianpaul | morning | 23:12 |
| wolfspraul | what do you guys think about making an open/copyleft LED driver board? | 23:12 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: (soldering iron) you should be able to get this locally. they're not too exotic. | 23:12 |
| wolfspraul | a Chinese friend of mine is working on one and I'm wondering whether I can help him in any way | 23:13 |
| wolfspraul | same as Jon's speakers there't not that much software on it though :-) | 23:13 |
| wpwrak | wolfspraul: what kind of LEDs ? | 23:13 |
| kristianpaul | i need LEDs to iluminate the backyard :) | 23:13 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: hah, I only buy components in d-k when I can't find them in terra. d-k is quite painful to pay and also shipping is _not_ straightforward | 23:13 |
| kristianpaul | or at least i want give a try toe LED tech :) | 23:13 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: phew :) | 23:13 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: i'd stick with halogen for a few more decades :) | 23:14 |
| kristianpaul | really? | 23:14 |
| kristianpaul | but they got damaged and... oh well | 23:14 |
| wolfspraul | I don't know that much about it, I think 'normal' LEDs? | 23:14 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: well, now you've done d-k once. probably is smoother now. | 23:14 |
| wolfspraul | the board attaches to a package with 70 leds I think | 23:14 |
| wolfspraul | basically it's an intelligent power supply | 23:14 |
| wpwrak | so what do the leds do ? | 23:15 |
| wolfspraul | with an Altera epm570T100 cpld controlling the power supply | 23:15 |
| kristianpaul | display cool 128 x 128 bit images? | 23:15 |
| wolfspraul | illuminate | 23:15 |
| wolfspraul | no | 23:15 |
| kristianpaul | oh | 23:15 |
| wolfspraul | a lamp | 23:15 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: halogen is cheap to replace - no matter what the damage is :) | 23:15 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: sure ;) | 23:15 |
| wolfspraul | first I will try to get some more data :-) | 23:16 |
| wpwrak | cpld and this kind of circuit sounds a little unusual. i could imagine an mcu with pcm, though | 23:16 |
| wolfspraul | maybe Adam can help him with a small run and we can learn something? don't know yet | 23:16 |
| wolfspraul | no only that cpld, plus LM139 comparator to monitor the output, plus some mosfets | 23:16 |
| kristianpaul | sounds fancy for just a lamp, but i'm curious | 23:17 |
| wolfspraul | he made a prototype board and will show it at a LED fair in guangzhou in a few days | 23:17 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: why not use CPLD if you need a lot of pwm's, but nothing more? | 23:19 |
| whitequark | sounds like a sane choice for me | 23:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | o.O | 23:21 |
| whitequark | I guess it is not :) | 23:21 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: now that the second board works too, I think I've found a flaw in my soldering habit which has caused all this crap | 23:22 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: well yes. if you need lots of fast PWMs :) but an MCU can provide quite a lot of not so fast PWMs via software. LEDs don't need a PWM running at MHz ;-) but perhaps there are requirements we don't know. also, maybe he just likes cplds :) | 23:23 |
| wpwrak | (soldering) heh ! :) experience makes the master | 23:23 |
| wolfspraul | here's a bit of high-level info I could get so far http://pastebin.com/FbRHWMgU | 23:23 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: I'm holding the hot air gun at a small angle, and the component, no matter it's just 1mm high, blocks the air flow to the other side of it, causing it to not solder to the board | 23:23 |
| wpwrak | hmm, i just go around the component with the hot air | 23:24 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: do i need a hot air gun or the iron should be okay? | 23:24 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: when I beginned to do the same, the boards suddenly began to work | 23:25 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: i've only truly needed hot air once so far, and that was for the atben//atusb crystal | 23:25 |
| kristianpaul | why? | 23:25 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: ;-) | 23:25 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: because for all the rest, an iron works, too :) | 23:25 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: how much years/centuries of experience do you have? | 23:25 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: the crystal has large pads at the bottom | 23:25 |
| kristianpaul | so heat went away easilly? | 23:26 |
| kristianpaul | wolfspraul: 70w wow ! | 23:26 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: how can you solder something with pads underneath the chip like LGA or WSON with an iron if you have a board with a solder mask where you can't heat the traces directly? | 23:26 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: heh, not all that long ;-) must have been around 2005 when i got interested again (i played a bit with electronics as a kid but didn't really get much done) | 23:27 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: WSON has a bit of metal on the side | 23:27 |
| Action: kristianpaul strugles in getting a bom | 23:27 | |
| wpwrak | whitequark: and for DIY, i have no solder mask anyway :) | 23:27 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: indeed it does, but I was unable to solder it with just the metal. I've tried getting a solder blob on the tip of my iron and touching the WSON sides with that blob | 23:28 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: does "H-bridge" in wolfspraul's spec make any sense to you ? | 23:29 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: except as a self-destruct mechanism for the LEDs perhaps :) | 23:29 |
| kristianpaul | argh, that .net file is too uglgy to print in raw -- | 23:29 |
| DocScrutinizer | what's "wolfg specs"? | 23:30 |
| wpwrak | wolfspraul: even 250 kHz is well within MCU territory :) | 23:30 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: http://pastebin.com/FbRHWMgU | 23:30 |
| kristianpaul | wolfspraul, fyi i got two boards from gnss-sdr.ru also some components, now i if get this build i can have a second source of data and compare results easilly ;) | 23:31 |
| kristianpaul | to give you a quick update, i'm currently working on the tracking algorythms for namuru | 23:32 |
| kristianpaul | not big deal? but i need re-enforce my C knowledge a bit :) | 23:32 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: (soldering WSON) hmm. looks similar to QFN to me. they're quite doable. the ones without metal on the side are evil, though | 23:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: hardly | 23:33 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: yeah, it's quite like qfn | 23:33 |
| wolfspraul | [likes cpld] yes he's an IC designer | 23:33 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: any response from the DIY GPS guy in the UK ? | 23:33 |
| wpwrak | wolfspraul: that would explain it :) | 23:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | unless they plan to use a cascade multiplier to drive a lot of LEDs in series | 23:33 |
| wolfspraul | I'm sure pretty much everything in electronics can be built in 10 different ways, so? | 23:33 |
| wolfspraul | yes, I've heard 'series led' somewhere | 23:34 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: tesla would be so proud ;-) | 23:34 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: yeap, http://paste.debian.net/hidden/87191b1a/ | 23:34 |
| kristianpaul | wpwrak: links most of milkymist, qi-hardware related | 23:35 |
| wolfspraul | the cpld currently uses 242 logic cells, with some more functionality should still stay < 1k, or could be reduced to ca. 100 for a low-cost derivative | 23:35 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: oh wow, from tomorrow. he's really ahead of his time :) | 23:35 |
| kristianpaul | hum? | 23:36 |
| kristianpaul | Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2011 09:50:20 +0100 | 23:36 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: anonymous posted at 2011-10-16 01:34:46 | 23:36 |
| kristianpaul | sorry i missed on the pastebin | 23:36 |
| wpwrak | :) | 23:36 |
| kristianpaul | X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.59 | 23:36 |
| kristianpaul | of that make you happy :) | 23:37 |
| kristianpaul | s/of/if | 23:37 |
| wpwrak | eek | 23:37 |
| Action: whitequark has just unsoldered that hirose connector back, just for the sake of doing it | 23:37 | |
| whitequark | I haven't melted it, yay! | 23:38 |
| wolfspraul | ok I will gather some more info about the led driver board... | 23:39 |
| wolfspraul | if we can open it up, maybe it's worthwhile to help with a little small run | 23:39 |
| kristianpaul | lamps are very wellcome over the world i guess, so worth the try i think | 23:42 |
| kristianpaul | and the battery is a good plus | 23:42 |
| wpwrak | lamps are also still difficult economically. leds are still too expensive. | 23:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | I can't see use for a cpld there, for the one-line dimming etc it's too low level, for controlling the H-bridge it's overkill. Any stupid 4bit or 8bit uC will do just fine | 23:45 |
| kristianpaul | 10 + 1 ways ;) | 23:46 |
| wpwrak | yeah :) i'd pick an MCU, too. but then, if you're a hammer, everything looks like a nail, right ? :) | 23:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | you don't need "lots of independent PWM" for controlling an illumination LED array | 23:46 |
| wpwrak | depends on what else the LED array is supposed to do. i wouldn't be surprised if it, say, grew USB at some moment in time, too :) | 23:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehe | 23:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | USB and cpld? hardly | 23:48 |
| wpwrak | the usual answer to this is ftdi :) | 23:48 |
| wpwrak | and the rest is a software problem :) | 23:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | the whole thing is mainly just a PSU | 23:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | there's just so much you could possibly innovate in PSU design | 23:50 |
| kristianpaul | energy efficient : 95% ? :) | 23:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | :shrug: | 23:51 |
| wpwrak | a random number | 23:51 |
| kristianpaul | :-| | 23:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | prolly, | 23:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | >>a novel design realized with no radiator<< | 23:52 |
| wpwrak | at least he's engineer enough that he knows it can't be 100% ;-) but the rest sounds more like marketing speek | 23:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure, with only as little as 3.5W to dissipate ;-D | 23:52 |
| wpwrak | yeah, particularly that :) | 23:52 |
| kristianpaul | :\ | 23:52 |
| wpwrak | naw, "delivered power" 70W. are those LEDs _really_ so efficient ? | 23:53 |
| kristianpaul | is it china, no? | 23:53 |
| kristianpaul | i mean, i wonder what world of kind of LEDs there are | 23:53 |
| wpwrak | agreed. he didn't specify for how long this is suppose to work | 23:53 |
| kristianpaul | he :) | 23:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: I guess that's power TO leds, not OUTPUT power from leds | 23:54 |
| wpwrak | maybe it's an array with 10 cm of metal structure between LEDs. that would work nicely :) | 23:54 |
| wolfspraul | yes | 23:54 |
| kristianpaul | at least during the fair ;-) | 23:54 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: doesn't really matter - you'll still burn a lot in LED losses :) | 23:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure | 23:54 |
| wolfspraul | ok we know little :-) | 23:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | as with any other light emitting technology | 23:55 |
| wpwrak | kristianpaul: is was more thinking in terms of fractions of a second :) | 23:55 |
| wolfspraul | I think conceptually yes, it's just a smart power supply | 23:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | :-D | 23:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | wolfspraul: no matter how smart it gets, finally you'll find it kinda looks like http://www.analog.com/static/imported-files/images/functional_block_diagrams/ADP1653_fbl.gif | 23:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | s/one or two LEDs/a random number of LEDs/ | 23:59 |
| wpwrak | that's already quite fancy :) | 23:59 |
| --- Sun Oct 16 2011 | 00:00 | |
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