#qi-hardware IRC log for Tuesday, 2011-10-11

zrafakristianpaul: wpwrak : I will not show our cool scope and you will envy our tools because you will have the doub haha00:25
wpwrakzrafa: ;-)01:35
DocScrutinizerwpwrak: hey, every now and then I run again into "originally written by Werner Almesberger" when it comes to cmdline tools02:06
DocScrutinizerI wonder if that means anything that it's usually in manpages that I rarely ever need - probably because the tool is so pretty intuitive to use :-)02:07
wpwrakkillall ? ;-)02:09
wpwraki can't quite claim the credit for the ease of use of the tools in psmisc - they all were inspired by SGI's IRIX02:11
wpwrakthere are some more in common use, but they're less intuitive and tend to be used somewhere in the bowels of the system. things like pivot_root.02:12
DocScrutinizerOMG pivot_root :-D02:34
wpwrak(-:C02:34
DocScrutinizer>>Some of the more obscure uses of pivot_root() may quickly lead to insanity.<<02:35
DocScrutinizerfunny enugh I've read pivot_root manpage just yesterday02:39
wpwrakhmm, i wonder if a had a hand in writing this man page ... don't quite remember :)02:40
wpwrakwell, not in the man page itself. i'm pretty sure about that. but the README things were copied from.02:41
DocScrutinizerwell, no Almesberger mentioned in pivot_root manpage, it's actually been killall that I referred to above02:41
wpwrakheh, a popular choice :)02:42
qwebirc26856Just got the nanonote today.  I booted it up, then reflashed, but now it will only turn on when plugged into the usb.  04:58
qwebirc26856Is there something I am not aware of?  04:59
wpwrakqwebirc26856: welcome to the club ! :) sounds like an empty or not properly connected battery05:00
wpwrakmaybe try removing USB and battery, wait ~20 seconds, then insert the battery again, then press the power button for a few seconds. that should do the trick.05:01
qwebirc26856Each time I plug the usb cable in the light flashes red then turns off.05:01
wpwrakthat is, unless the battery is empty05:01
qwebirc26856When I charged the battery earlier today the red light stayed on.  It turns off now so I think the battery is good.  No luck with waiting 20 seconds with all power unplugged.05:05
wpwrakhmm, strange then. when you bring it up with USB, everything looks healthy ?05:06
qwebirc26856wpwrak:  Yep.  New os and all.05:07
wpwrakwhat exactly did you install ?05:07
qwebirc26856The latest openWrt image05:09
wpwrakhmm, haven't heard of any such issues with it. i didn't update things in my bens for a while.05:11
wpwrakmaybe someone else knows ?05:11
qwebirc26856I will do another reflash, see what happens.  Thanks05:13
qwebirc26856wpwrak:  one of the spring wires connecting the battery was pushed back.  06:51
qwebirc26856I brought it out and now the battery is charging.06:51
qwebirc26856Thanks for the suggestions.06:51
rejon_heya, does nanonote support this project http://taskwarrior.org08:10
rejon_hahaha08:10
rejon_just had another thought about the nanonote and html5 apps08:10
rejon_i only want to use the nanonote as an offline device08:10
rejon_only CLI08:10
rejon_those are the basics for a whole company08:10
rejon_just implement a web service on top of all the commandline apps08:11
rejon_from top to bottom08:11
rejon_with the synchronization layer as the for pay service08:11
rejon_nanonote is the embodiment of the strength of the service08:11
virickyak: I think your use of 'rss' is similar to my use of 'email' (regarding mailing lists) :)09:29
kristianpaulrejon_: i do use my nanonote to browse static html pages elinks worsks decently11:24
kristianpauland veyr handy, you can have lots of manuals, and guides in less of 512Mb :-)11:25
rejon_kristianpaul, great11:44
qi-botThe build was successfull, see images here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/compile-log/openwrt-xburst.full_system-10102011-0859/13:31
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/plot: analyze console log and plot probability distribution (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/5ac880016:27
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/plot: corrected terminology and presentation of empirical cdf (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/ebc8a1e16:27
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/plot: renamed to plot-cdf (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/ddd833816:27
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/bcmp: compare bitstreams and highlight differences (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/04e7d1116:27
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/collda: report collateral damage in non-standby partitions (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/b012a1a16:27
wpwrakzrafa: now, tell us about the dinosaur rodolfo dug out for you :)16:52
kristianpaulI was thinking the time, we have lots of already command line apps ported to nanonote17:00
kristianpaulbut all still command, and seems SDL programing is hard to implement?17:01
kristianpaulSo what alternative we have for example to make this things esier17:01
kristianpaulan example,sox17:01
wpwraka good start may be to use X ;-)17:02
kristianpaulahh !!17:02
kristianpauli was about to ask about sdl python bidings? or may be curses?17:02
wpwrakSDL has quite some stuff, too. but it's a lot more obscure than the usual suspects for X.17:02
wpwrak(obscure) in the sense of "unknown". not necessarily hard to understand17:02
kristianpauli mean not the BLUE curses, but something purple, green yellow may look at least different17:02
kristianpaulbut you dont need soem very very elaborate17:03
kristianpaulfor example sox, and script that generate two 3 buttons, record play stop17:03
kristianpaulmay be reverse/forward too17:03
kristianpaulwritten in what? perl? python? with SDL.ncurses?17:03
wpwraki think SDL has some widget set17:04
wpwrakhttp://members.chello.nl/w.boeke/SDL-widgets/index.html17:04
wpwrakfancy enough ? :)17:05
kristianpaulfor jlime zrafa did a nice fronted for sox,in seconds !!17:05
kristianpaulbut of course was all X and gtk? (in dont rember well)17:05
wpwrakhe may have used SDL. he did quite a few things with it.17:05
kristianpaulyeah, looks nice17:06
viricwpwrak: wow, nice widgets. That's SDL? great17:20
viricdo you run linux 3 in the nanonote?17:21
kristianpaulsoon !17:21
viricah :)17:21
kristianpaulwpwrak: too fancy actually, i was thinking something more simmple17:23
kristianpaulsome buttons and text boxes17:24
kristianpaulthere is not much space in screen i think..17:24
Aylatry EFL17:26
kristianpaulay,yes B_Lizzard mentioned that too i remnber. right?17:26
kristianpaulsay/ah17:26
B_LizzardWhat17:27
kristianpaulYou think EFL rules for embeded?17:27
B_LizzardNot yet, there's little keyboard accessibility thingie going on17:28
B_LizzardOtherwise, I guess it is.17:28
B_LizzardThe grey stuff is GTK 1.217:28
B_LizzardLast release: 200117:29
B_LizzardAW YEAH17:29
kristianpaulhum,may be gtk will not be so slow for simple menus17:30
kristianpaulor agree with wpwrak and switch to X, (wich looks kinda mad to the date)17:31
B_LizzardMuffinman uses X17:31
kristianpaulyou have to remenber us that all time !!? ;)17:32
B_LizzardMUFFINMAN IS BETTER17:33
B_LizzardI AM RULE17:33
wpwrakall your base belong to us ?17:33
Aylaare belong*17:34
wpwrakah, silly me17:34
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/Makefile: one Makefile to rule them (scripts) all (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/e9bdf5f17:42
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/collda: cycle of corruption is last good cycle + 1 (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/71495fe17:42
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: m1rc3/norruption/2/bscmp: show number of corruption as i/n instead of (n) (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/wernermisc/a83a71117:42
kristianpauldid gtkperfm ran slow at old days?17:46
zrafakristianpaul: when you talk about gtk you need to specify exactly which versoin of gtk18:01
kristianpaulyes sorry18:04
kristianpaulbut i dont know18:04
virichave you seen the film Moebius? Does the Buenos Aires metro inspire all that as in the film? :)18:05
wpwrakmaybe in a few centuries. they're extending the network very very slowly.18:07
viric:) ok18:08
zrafakristianpaul: gtk1.. which blizzard talks is from 2001 last release18:11
zrafakristianpaul: and it is really fast for embedded18:12
zrafakristianpaul: but no gtk2.. IIRC gtk2 uses a lot float p calculations18:12
zrafakristianpaul: and if you use it for our tiny embedded world you will kill yourself :)18:12
zrafawpwrak: you thereĀ”?18:13
zrafawpwrak: I have news.. you would llike to read :)18:13
wpwraktell me ! :)18:14
zrafawpwrak: scope: noising model  n-220 oscilloscope18:15
wpwrakwhat does "noising model" mean ?18:16
zrafaNoising is the machine. 18:17
zrafais the name18:17
zrafaor mark18:17
wpwrakoh, i see18:17
wpwrakinsteresting choice of name :)18:18
wpwrakseema that all google hits are about de-noising ...18:19
wpwrakis it really exactly "noising" ?18:20
zrafawpwrak: yes :) .. and I can not find a picture using google images :P18:20
zrafait is Noising model n-220 oscilloscope18:20
zrafamade in korea18:20
wpwrakcan you take a picture ?18:21
zrafayes, at home. Rodolfo lend me it so I will bring to home18:21
steve|ma scope which has "Noise" in its name.. nice ;)18:21
kristianpaulhow many channels it have?18:21
kristianpaulhe bring the probes as well?18:21
kristianpaulsteve|m: ;)18:21
zrafakristianpaul: I see ch A and ch B18:22
kristianpaulgood18:22
kristianpauldo you recognice any computer-like port on it?18:23
wpwrakdoes it say something about the analog bandwidth somewhere ?18:25
wpwrakalso, does it have a screen ? if yes, LCD or CRT ?18:25
kristianpauldoes it turn on?18:26
zrafawpwrak: I would say CRT18:26
wpwrakdoes it even work with electricity ? ;-)18:26
zrafakristianpaul: yes18:26
kristianpaulnoce18:26
wpwrak(crt) uh uh ... that's not very promising18:26
kristianpauls/noce/nice18:27
zrafayou all envy me18:27
zrafahaha18:27
wpwrak220 may mean 2 channels, 20 MHz. these are quite common characteristics for analog scopes.18:28
wpwrakwell, it'll let you see simple signal shapes. it won't help much with analyzing complex digital communications, though.18:30
kristianpaulzrafa: actually sebastien have an analog one too i had read18:37
zrafawpwrak: I am not sure that I will understand complex digital communications18:39
zrafawpwrak: so anyway, with a good scope or not I will need a real hand from hw people18:39
zrafawpwrak: I meant "I am sure that I will not understand ... " :)18:40
wpwrakoh, you'll learn. usb is a very good topic for learning quite a lot :)18:45
zrafawpwrak: we just test a simple version of blinkenlights turning on/off the pin 9 of PDDAT (CMD on ubb), with 50000 microseconds between setting/clearing and I saw the signal on scope :)19:27
wpwrakhehe :)19:29
wpwrakcongratulations on your first real scope experience ! ;-)19:30
zrafawpwrak: thanks, but all is from your work . I modified blinkenlights :)19:44
zrafaand rodolfo did the scope part haha19:44
DocScrutinizerclassical scopes are useful for analog only19:44
DocScrutinizerwhere analog includes proper analog signal levels (and shapes, sometimes) on digital lnes19:46
DocScrutinizerlines19:46
wpwrakDocScrutinizer: yeah, you need a dark room and quick eyes to do much with them for non-repetitive signals19:47
wpwrakzrafa: (reused blinkenlights) so you put it to good use. very nice ! :)19:47
DocScrutinizeron a second thought, levels includes the aspects of shapes that can usefully get examined with a scope19:47
DocScrutinizerthough -> wiki eyepattern19:49
wpwrakheh, don't get me started :)19:49
wpwrakstill need a to see a scope that can do this without costing as much as a decent car: http://people.openmoko.org/werner/rigol/eye-out-better.png19:51
wpwrak(that was generated by scripts operating on a long recording of my DSO)19:53
DocScrutinizerwpwrak: isn't averaging over 106 samples somewhat defeating the purpose of an eye pattern?20:07
wpwrakit's not averaging. it's overlaying.20:08
DocScrutinizeroooh20:08
viricwhy is that called eye pattern?20:08
DocScrutinizersee wiki20:08
DocScrutinizerit "looks like two eyes"20:08
viricThere were no results matching the query.20:09
DocScrutinizeresp with sine waves ;-)20:09
DocScrutinizererr20:09
virichm.. I don't really see the eyes :)20:09
DocScrutinizerhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye_pattern20:10
viricah I looked at the qi wiki20:12
viricI'd never name the wikipedia 'wiki'20:12
viric:)20:12
DocScrutinizerfair point, sorry20:15
zrafawpwrak: I could not bring it to home. Rain here.. But I found some picture in internet of some scope very similar:20:24
zrafahttp://imagine41.com/catalog/product/gallery/image/1192/id/757/20:24
zrafaThat front is very very similar and the back as well20:24
zrafa(you can see others pictures with "next" link)20:25
wpwrakrain ! in neuquen !?! :)20:25
zrafawpwrak: in fact.. now I did zoom.. the front is almost exact to the "Noising oscilloscope"20:26
zrafawpwrak: special day here :)20:26
zrafawpwrak: if you do zoom with the CTRL+mouse whell you will read the labels on front. It is almost identical I would say20:27
zrafayes. it is identical. I am sure now :). Now it seems that many have different names.. check the two screws where you put your label with the name of the machine :)20:28
wpwrakyeah, it's a basic analog scope. as we suspected.20:28
wpwrak(many names) heh ;-)20:28
kristianpaulcute :-)20:58
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