#qi-hardware IRC log for Monday, 2011-08-15

DocScrutinizerworst of all, as always on CCC events all the connectivity was mere crap00:00
wolfspraulyou mean the network?00:00
wolfspraulbut I thought they spend a lot of time and energy on that?00:00
DocScrutinizerWLANs, GSM-GPRS, UMTS...00:01
DocScrutinizerall flaky00:01
DocScrutinizerlocal test GSM was nice :-) Alas without GPRS00:01
DocScrutinizermet Harald for ~10min00:02
DocScrutinizerDieter still doing a lot for Osmocom. Next target: suraya - I'm highly intrigued00:02
wolfspraulwas there a wired network too?00:03
DocScrutinizergoogle suraya sat00:05
DocScrutinizerwolfspraul: yes, there's been 100BT, but nobody of us had cables, and on a camp cables are kinda useless anyway00:06
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: what is google suraya and what does Dieter plan to do with it?00:09
wolfspraulI googled but couldn't find much :-)00:09
DocScrutinizererr mompl00:09
kristianpaulneither a TLE, eve cant find on gpredict..00:09
DocScrutinizerwolfspraul: you know the osmocom crew (HW, DS) did GSM and now TETRA security checks and "pentests"00:10
kristianpaulis this related with satellite phones? was last words i heard from Harald's talk about TETRA00:10
kristianpaulmay be you want to mean thuraya? https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Thuraya00:12
kristianpaulsu/thu sounds very similiar i think ;)00:12
wolfspraulok thuraya I've heard about, and also quite interested in it...00:13
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: yes I know, but what is google suraya now? :-) do you have a url?00:13
DocScrutinizergogling myself00:13
wolfspraulah Thuraya, cool00:15
wolfspraulwell that's really interesting indeed00:15
wolfspraulso Dieter and/or Harald or the whole osmocom do something about Thuraya now? like what?00:16
DocScrutinizerHarald told me old news Thuraya protocol is a pimped GSM00:26
DocScrutinizerand everything openly speced00:26
DocScrutinizermight be fun, though both expensive and possibly asking for real trouble00:27
DocScrutinizerjust to *start* you need hw for $$$$00:28
DocScrutinizerI always wonder who's paying for Harald's hobbies00:28
DocScrutinizerand if you hack Thuraya, you might face unsolicited visits of some very US-american tough guys that don't like you to publish their backdoors to that sat network00:29
kristianpaulah, not in my view00:29
kristianpaulreal trouble.. yeah, i had heard from brazil00:30
kristianpaulnot counting from my country in the 90's i think... :)00:30
wolfspraulyou guys worry far too much about 'trouble'00:32
kristianpaulsomethimes "hack" could be no intentional i had heard of such us cases for HAM satellites00:32
wolfspraulif some kids in the basement (or small office, ok) can hack into something, then foreign agencies like Chinese are long secretly recording 100% of traffic they can capture anywhere00:33
wolfspraulwe should focus on making something work, everybody will appreciate the new opportunities00:33
kristianpaulfirst put your satellite i would say :)00:33
wolfspraulI was looking at the Thuraya modules recently, and wondered about schematics, bom, chips they use etc.00:34
wolfspraulif it's not open yet, let's open it ;-)00:34
kristianpaulDocScrutinizer: i think fora 300usd phone is not such expensive http://cgi.ebay.com/Satellite-Phone-Thuraya-SO-2510-Battery-charger-USB-/250847487749?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item3a67ace70500:35
wolfsprauldoes anybody have URLs to Thuraya schematics, chips/bom, etc?00:35
kristianpaulalso satellites shares some specs with i.e TV receivers, so coming projects like that funcube dongle for example is not so uncommon for next years00:35
DocScrutinizerwolfspraul: (looking for thuraya modules) :-D \o/ wasn'T that what I sugested for a GTA04-special-edition?00:36
DocScrutinizerback when there's been a OM GTA04 in the pipe00:37
DocScrutinizerI bet it was on my brainstorming list00:38
DocScrutinizerprobably next to laser and electromotor for moving the pop-out camera00:39
DocScrutinizer>>The customer is warned that GSM cellular mode in certain third world countries is often more expensive that Thuraya "satellite" mode.<<00:56
kristianpaulactually i cant see Thuraya, in my skyview00:57
DocScrutinizerLOL on that though: >>Thuraya offers a 9600 bps data rate, which corresponds to about 4 MegaBytes (MB) an hour. This means Thuraya is very suitable for light to moderate data applications such as email or web browing(!!)<<00:57
kristianpaulat least i'm missing more satellites...00:57
DocScrutinizerkristianpaul: ??00:57
DocScrutinizermore thuraya sats?00:57
kristianpaulthuraya-1,2 and 300:57
kristianpauli got some TLEs :-)00:57
DocScrutinizerI don't think this sheik is pondering to shoot up a 2nd sat00:58
kristianpaulbut i found on a osmocom header file that Thuraya is also a gsm network, s i'm confused now...00:59
kristianpaulmay be the do roaming? :)00:59
kristianpaulDocScrutinizer: gpredict is a very interesting software when you want to know what's passing over you :)01:02
DocScrutinizer[2011-08-15 02:26:44] <DocScrutinizer> Harald told me old news Thuraya protocol is a pimped GSM01:02
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: ok so who is doing Thuraya hacking and what is the goal?01:02
DocScrutinizerwlfI dunno01:03
DocScrutinizerwolfspraul: ^^^01:03
DocScrutinizercya next day, I'm wasted01:04
DocScrutinizern8 (and OM chandra still down, so still main mail acct dead, and mails bouncing)01:12
wolfspraulSebastien found a pretty cool guy with a private vacuum electronics lab http://tubedevices.com/alek/pwl/o_pwl_e.htm02:49
kristianpaulwolfspraul: had you visited mediatek?03:17
wolfspraulI had meetings with mediatek representatives yes, but it's a long time ago03:21
wolfspraulthat's a huge company, so I'm not sure what you mean with 'visited mediatek'03:21
kristianpaulnever mind, just asking in general, as when you visit ingenic and bought somw chips by cash ;)03:23
kristianpaulbut yes, big company different products lines..03:24
kristianpaulsure visit to buy chips is not that general of course, just wondering same posibilites with mediatek no more from there03:27
wolfspraulyou can buy mediatek chips in any quantity (down to 1) for a few USD on the street market in Shenzhen and other places03:27
kristianpaulafaik you cant do too much with it03:28
wolfspraulwhy not?03:30
kristianpaulsure is posible, jsut wondering linux suport, datasheets03:32
wolfspraulthat's what osmocombb is working on03:32
kristianpaulah, cool03:33
kristianpaulwell i dint mentioned GSM 03:33
kristianpaulwell, i think i found my problem with namuru03:42
kristianpaulall this time i tought i was enabling some logic this way:03:43
kristianpaulcase(addr) 8'hxx  reg <= 1'b1;03:44
kristianpaulbut i dint work..03:44
kristianpauli dont know if this a coding mistake from my part...03:44
kristianpaulbut actually i never seem that implemented in a mux...03:45
kristianpaulwich actually go this way:  case(addr) 8'hxx reg <= data_in[x];03:46
kristianpaulso, i'll definetelly will broke the original memory mapping of namuru, wich actually i dont see reason for keep it03:46
kristianpaulanyway, that also calm down my worrying about who hells the enable signals for some internal modules in namuru was going to be disabled some day..03:48
kristianpaulquestion is, should i do this in the same clock cycle..03:49
kristianpaulcause if that the path the only way i see is include the enable as the MSB in the value of the register i'm actually writing for example to the NCO..03:50
kristianpaulnah, too odd03:50
kristianpaulseparate enable register will be, and first i write value to foo register and later i enable the logic03:51
kristianpaulasociated with it03:51
kristianpaulwolfspraul: i comented about MTK cause i think i start see some blackperry/nockia clones in my local makerket at least in the city i work03:52
kristianpaulvery few, but looked like clones for sure :)03:54
Action: kristianpaul zzz06:22
kristianpaulArtyom, i now got values 2 and 3  from STATUS , but NEW_DATA still zero same as accumlators...06:57
kristianpaulbut i least i fixed the issue with the enable signals, moving it to a dedicated enabled register06:58
kristianpaulbtw, so you never load NCO vales for the carrier?, can you remenber me later the intialization worflow and tracking loop implemented in your acquisition code?06:59
kristianpaulcause i'm enabling and intializing in this order: prog tic, accum tic, ch0 prn key, carrier nco, ch0 code nco, ch0 code slew and last is enable signal for ch007:01
kristianpaulthen i just keep clearing status jsut after reading it on my loop07:03
kristianpaulsame when reading accumlators07:03
kristianpaulat least i got accum int to work.. now need to find what wrong with accumulators zeros...07:03
GitHub145[milkymist] kristianpaul pushed 2 new commits to gps-sdr-testing: https://github.com/kristianpaul/milkymist/compare/67e3a3e...5ac6a7d07:09
GitHub145[milkymist/gps-sdr-testing] Separate Accumlator status from init - Cristian Paul Peñaranda Rojas07:09
GitHub145[milkymist/gps-sdr-testing] Enable control for channels is now a separate register, same case of clear flag for both status and new_data registers - Cristian Paul Peñaranda Rojas07:09
Aylahow can I compile jzboot?11:26
xiangfuAyla, under xburst-tools folder run: ./autogen.sh11:27
xiangfu  ./configure --enable-firmware CROSS_COMPILE=mipsel-openwrt-linux- --prefix=/usr --sysconfdir=/etc11:27
Aylaxiangfu: thanks, but I did checkout only jzboot from http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/jzboot/11:28
xiangfuAyla, check this: http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Xburst-tools#build11:29
xiangfuonly jzboot will not working. jzboot is a submodule of xburst-tools11:29
AylaI installed the .deb11:32
`antonio`wpwrak, I ma trying to build the kernel for the wpan kit, I am building it using my toolchain and I flash it into my own image. but every time i get the kernel panic error13:18
`antonio`kernel panic not syncing vfs unable to mount root fs on unknown-block (0 0)13:19
`antonio`what could it be and how can I solve it.13:19
`antonio`I am using the master revision toolchain btw13:20
xiangfu`antonio`, where you get the toolchain?13:33
`antonio`I build my own toolchain with the qi-hardware feeds13:34
`antonio`from the qi-hardware git 13:34
xiangfuand the rootfs is latest openwrt release right?13:35
`antonio`i am using my own root rootfs 13:36
xiangfuthe kernel and rootfs better use same toolchain.13:37
`antonio`yes from same toolchain 13:37
`antonio`basically i flash my own image on nanonote and then I build werner's kernel separately using the same toolchain 13:38
`antonio`but when i install it I get that error.13:38
`antonio`the kernel seems to be built fine, but there must be something I am missing13:39
`antonio`some configurations perhaps13:40
kristianpaulArtyom: hello13:43
xiangfu`antonio`, you follow those steps http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/ben-wpan/source/tree/master/install/INSTALL-Ben right?13:44
Artyomhi kristianpaul13:46
ArtyomI've found some bugs in my code today. :) Something connected with status-reg13:49
kristianpaulWell, go ahed first i also founed bugs (of my porting..)13:50
ArtyomVery stange behaviour... I receiver only zeros from status-reg ;)13:51
xiangfu`antonio`, here is the problem.13:51
ArtyomBut now I know where I should dig :)13:51
viricAnyone mastering the boottime ip configuration of linux?13:51
viric(ip=dhcp kernel commandline)13:52
xiangfuI found the 'ben-wpan' branch use a 1.5 rootfs. you can try to reflash rootfs and try again.13:52
kristianpaulArtyom: i was supposing to enable some logic in anmuru by doing enable_reg <= 1'b1; inside a case statement13:52
kristianpaulArtyom: now i get 2 and 3 from status13:52
kristianpaulArtyom: but bit high in new_data, also accumulators still zeroed, but at least i have one thing less to worry about (for now i hope)13:53
viricI wonder how to check the result of "ip=dhcp" from the booted linux13:53
viricfrom usermode13:53
kristianpaulArtyom: I managed to solve this implementing aditional register for enable stuff for the correlator and a separate clear flag for status13:54
kristianpaulyou have idea why accumulators are zeroed?, first thing came to my mind division by zero of course ;)13:54
kristianpaulbut i'm bit worried this mixing is done with combinational logic13:55
ArtyomI couldn't find in your code how "accum_sample_enable" signal is generated... Can you point me?13:59
kristianpaulit came from time base, let me point some lins14:01
kristianpaulremenber i have namuru code in separate branch (gps-sdr-testing)14:01
Artyomyes, I'm watching it14:02
kristianpaulhell, where is time base...14:03
kristianpaulwhat?? i dint connect that wire..14:05
Artyomseems so...14:05
kristianpaulgee 14:05
kristianpauli feel ashamed now :)14:05
kristianpaulyou found another bug in the code, thanks a lot Artyom !14:06
kristianpaulthe joy of porting :)14:06
ArtyomI feel the same ;) With my port ;)14:06
kristianpaulbtw i was asking a guy wich work with avalon14:07
kristianpaulI had some concerns about how that enabled logic is set(and unset?)14:08
kristianpaulmostly because the use of write & chip_select14:09
kristianpaulhe pointed as it is implemente right now there is a chance for changing namuru registers in case you acess another slaves in the bus14:10
kristianpauldunno if this can affect your desing, just droping this worried to you14:12
kristianpaulhum, i'm crazy i disabled accum_sample_enable in my time base with aparently not reason..14:13
Artyomthanks for info. I think you've noticed that I already changed namuru registers addressing. And I think I will possibly do it again latter....14:14
kristianpaulah, i confused it with sample_clk -_- 14:15
kristianpaultoo many sample_* signals :)14:15
kristianpaulhum, but i is this accum_sample_enable really required?14:18
kristianpaulah, i see14:20
kristianpaulthats how namuru avoid to more sampling that it should14:20
kristianpaulwell, in my implementation i think is not neeed as namuru run with frontend clock14:21
`antonio`xiangfu, it worked ! thanks a lot14:23
Artyomyes, in your case it should be always '1'14:23
Artyomas I understand your design...14:23
kristianpaulyes you do rightly14:24
kristianpaulthat should fire the damn accumulators :)14:24
kristianpaulphew 18minutes 14:43
kristianpaulwhat?¿ zeros..14:46
kristianpaulwhy... arghg14:46
kristianpaulbbl going to take breakfast14:46
kristianpaulvirtual asic foundry ? http://www.iis.fraunhofer.de/en/bf/ic/dl/vaf/index.jsp 15:08
kristianpaul"European silicon foundries" ah,ok15:09
kristianpaulwb DocScrutinizer 16:17
DocScrutinizerwolfspraul: I dunno who's actually hacking thuraya right now. Harald suggested to better look into thuraya rather than IPv6 security. I asked him how far he and his "crew" got with that particular topic, and iirc he said they really are going to look into it, and there should be some details on osmocom.org or somewhere eventually16:21
DocScrutinizerthe OTA protocol for thuraya seems quite similar to plain old GSM16:22
DocScrutinizerthe 'public' OTA, not the trunk backend16:22
DocScrutinizerHarald claimed it's all well documented and specs publicly available16:23
DocScrutinizerthe sat itself has some awesome technical details, like dynamic beam focusing etc16:24
kyakwolfspraul: perhaps you already know, but i just stumbled upon another open hardware project: http://code.google.com/p/lightpack/ (it's in Russian, kind of "Philips Ambilight" DIY)16:29
kyakthe video is pretty cool :) i don't know if actual Philips technology works any better, but it definitely doesn't work with _any_ TV/monitor16:31
Jay7kyak: interesting17:05
Jay7other idea to use webcam instead of software client17:06
Jay7this may enable 'ambilight' for any TV :)17:06
kristianpaullekernel: have a minute?17:24
lekernelwhat for?17:24
kristianpaulhttp://paste.debian.net/126313/ line 24 and 2517:24
kristianpaulisnt okay?  i mean blocking asigment inside a always is not proper tight?17:26
lekernelyou can use non blocking here17:27
kristianpauli knew it !17:27
kristianpaulnow i need to understand why :)17:27
kristianpaulwhy was a used a blocking asigment in first place17:28
kristianpaulhum, so Artyom was right, acording to code gen core, i need at least enable and disable prn_key_enable in order to the dump_enable to work17:34
kristianpaulhum there is a hc_enable coming from code nco to code gen... i'll asume for now this work17:36
kristianpauli'm getting crazy with all those enbled signals coming from here and there.. seems not stop :)17:37
DocScrutinizerlekernel: you linked me to that poettering post about systemd. It scares me he's stating it depends on dbus, which seems to sugest dbus changed from middleware to a core system component17:41
larscdbus is the new unix-socket17:42
DocScrutinizerI damn sure would hate my embedded ATmega controller not to boot because there's some bug in *dbus* which I definitely never would want to run on that system anyway17:42
DocScrutinizerthis poettering guy seems to care quite little about cross platform. All his "improvements" are targeted exclusively at desktop PCs when I think about it17:45
kristianpaullarsc: what? no17:45
Action: kristianpaul havent had good experiences with gnome and dbus17:46
DocScrutinizerI gather in 5 yeras - when nobody stops poettering - not even a 8051 will boot anymore without proper pulseaudio support for playback of POST beeps, and without X support to display diagnostic msgs17:47
DocScrutinizer...on the 3 LEDs of that embedded device ;-P17:47
kristianpaulArtyom, check this out http://kristianpaul.org/~paul/tmp/namuru/hierarchy.html17:55
kyakJay7: heh yeah, webcam is a good idea, too17:56
Jay7DocScrutinizer: someone should stop him17:58
Action: Jay7 hate pulseaudio and dbus as core service17:58
larscsomebody should go back in time and stop him ;)17:58
viricsystemv forever!17:58
Jay7we will reprogram terminator 17:59
Jay7but I'm unsure that systemd or pulseaudio have no backdoor to prevent killing poettering :)18:00
viricsystemv. Not systemd. :)18:00
Jay7viric: I see :)18:00
viricTerminator, in the XXI century, would have most of the code in python.18:01
Jay7python is better than C#18:01
kristianpaulhaskell :-D18:01
ignatius-Anyone know where to get past versions of OpenWRT-Xburst kernel source code?20:22
mthqi-kernel git?20:22
ignatius-Like the 2010-11-17 version, for example.20:23
ignatius-The ones from "http://downloads.qi-hardware.com/software/images/NanoNote/Ben/"20:25
mthI don't know the process of adding the Qi patches to OpenWRT20:25
ignatius-Well, i'm just looking for kernel source (that I can compile), that will work on the Nanonote's NAND. I don't like having a drive that I can't use its entirity.20:26
mthyou can always go back in openwrt-xburst git to the older patch/diff files20:26
ignatius-I'm rather stupid in that department, though.20:26
mthideally they would be tagged, otherwise by date20:26
ignatius-So far, the JLime kernel source works... but, then no, ks7010 driver.20:27
ignatius-Tried compiling a ks7010 module outside of the source tree.... didn't work.20:27
mthjz-2.6.39 of qi-kernel is not working?20:28
ignatius-Does it support using the entire NAND?20:28
mthwhat is special about the entire NAND? is it just partitioning or is it multiple chips?20:28
ignatius-I don't like only having ~512MB user space.20:29
ignatius-And I don't like weird split partitions.20:29
mththe NAND partitioning is configured in the board-qi_lb60.c source20:29
mthafaik it's not specific to any kernel version, but rather a configuration option20:30
ignatius-Really? I've been spending hours upon hours trying to determine that. A kernel configuration option?20:30
ignatius-If so, which one(s)?20:30
mthah no, there are two configurations, one for 1GB and one for 2GB20:31
mthand the right one is autodetected20:31
ignatius-In which tree?20:31
mthso the only way to change the partitioning is the modify the table20:31
ignatius-Hmm. Damn.20:32
mthI'm using jz-3.0 of OpenDingux, but it's very similar to jz-2.6.39 of qi-kernel20:32
ignatius-Does it have support for the ks7010?20:32
mththe table is fairly straightforward though, just have a look20:32
mthwhat kind of device is the ks7010?20:33
qi-botThe build was successfull, see images here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/compile-log/openwrt-xburst.full_system-08142011-1719/20:33
mththis is the partition table for 2GB: http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/qi-kernel/source/tree/master/arch/mips/jz4740/board-qi_lb60.c#L8620:34
ignatius-It's a WIFI driver.20:34
ignatius-For the MicroSD slot.20:34
ignatius-Er. I mean it's a driver for a WIFI MicroSD card.20:35
mthah, that one20:35
mthI don't see ks7010 in drivers/net/wireless in jz-2.6.3920:36
mthif there is another git archive that does have the driver in a nearby kernel version, it might not be too hard to merge it though20:36
mthanyway, the partition table approach is the same for all kernel versions I've seen, so if you have a kernel with ks7010 support it should be easy to change the partitioning on that kernel20:38
ignatius-By replacing lines 86 - 103?20:40
ignatius-Would that work?20:40
ignatius-Er. Change, I mean.20:40
mthshould work, if the new values are correct20:41
mththe 0x100000 is probably the erase block size, so you should leave that as-is20:41
mthmake sure that every offset is equal to the previous one + previous size20:42
mthand use 2048 blocks in total20:42
ignatius-Hmm. Or would it be easier to just copy that file from a different tree...20:42
mthno, only copy the table then, not the entire file20:42
mththere have been changes in the rest of the file unrelated to NAND partitioning but necessary to properly init other devices20:43
ignatius-I see.20:43
mthit's similar to partitioning harddisks, with the start sector (offset) and number of sectors (size)20:44
ignatius-The "dd" Linux command is very helpful with that.20:46
mthwith filling HD partitions, yes, but creating is easier with fdisk ;)20:46
ignatius-I just use the standard fdisk. No cfdisk for me.20:47
--- Tue Aug 16 201100:00

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