#qi-hardware IRC log for Tuesday, 2011-06-14

tuxbrainand it's over!!!! atben 100% yield , 135 bright and powerful tiny boards tested and filling my head with 2,4GHz waves!!! atusb not bad just 3 down so 117 totally operative (116 if the sugru thing fails)00:05
wpwrakwhoohoo !! :)00:05
rohnice. congrats.00:05
wpwrak100% yield for atben makes sense. it's quite simple and has no mechanical components at all. so the yield - if non-zero - should be very high00:07
wpwrakatusb is more complex and has a mechanical component, hence more trouble00:08
rohyou mean the usb plug?00:08
tuxbrainsugru:report, well now it pas the gpios but the spectrum still as low as before, I will test tomorrow night  to see there is any improvement00:11
wpwrakroh: yup. i was a bit worried about this one. it "snaps" in. far from ideal for SMT.00:11
wpwraktuxbrain: (sugru) good. so the surface has cured and is no longer conductive. but the core still is. it may still work. this kind of stuff usually cures at ~8 h/mm.00:13
tuxbrainwpwrak: yeah, luckly the local smt fab are kind guys and had remove the anoying part of the panel, I'm sure in less considerated fabs, we will have a mess instad of a cool usb plug00:13
wpwraktuxbrain: you put about 2.5 mm. if we assume that the inside cures much more slowly, due to limited access to air, about 24 h would be the minimum until you can expect useful results00:14
tuxbrainok ok you know wait is not my strong point00:16
wpwraktuxbrain: (nice smt guys) weren't they in the loop when you discussed panelization with the PCB fab ? i thought they were. well, anyway the way the board was panelized, removing that part was easy.00:16
wpwraktuxbrain: (wait) it'll cure while you sleep ;-)00:16
tuxbrainsleep? what's that? ah! the thing my family does when I'm working00:17
wpwrakthey must have enjoyed a few rather restful days :)00:18
tuxbrainnah, my family also goes to the park while I'm working, my daughter goes to school while I'm working and my wife also enjoys tv while I'm working.... 00:19
Action: tuxbrain feels soooo sad00:20
wpwrakso they figured out that it's a bad idea to try to sync with you ;-)00:20
wpwrakwhy ? were you hoping for a few interesting failures to spend the rest of the night on analyzing ? ;-)00:21
tuxbrainnah, this month is specially hard in workload (you also know some of the reasons) and I miss to spend time just sitting in the sofa or listening my daughter theories about live00:22
tuxbrainwith nothing else in the head00:23
tuxbrainthat's the worst part, even if I found 5mins to sit down, there is a lot of mess in the head00:23
tuxbrainok a lot money save on psiquiatrics thanks to IRC00:24
tuxbrainI think the announce post will be rescheduled for tomorrow at some point, no enough stamina today00:25
tuxbraingonna sync with may family for 4 hours, tomorrow I need to look less an dungeon beast than I look now00:26
wpwrakhehe ;-)00:26
wpwrakthe green PASS will haunt your dreams ;-)00:28
wpwrakand the squiggly white snake in the red tunnel00:28
tuxbrain_PASSaaaaargh no the dancing white line and the green dot!!! aaaaarg00:29
wpwraktuxbrain_PASS: for the next run, you should try the testing with psychedelic drugs. the repetitiveness and general strangeness of the setting ought to produce interesting effects ;-)00:30
tuxbrain_HxxHhzommmm drugs.... so far in time and so ... not  tuxbrain bad boy bad boy, not until june has pass by :P00:31
tuxbrain_HxxHhzoPASS by00:31
Action: wpwrak should add audio indications to the testing process00:32
tuxbrain_HxxHhzometal please :)00:32
tuxbrain_HxxHhzogood night dude00:32
Action: DocScrutinizer giggles00:44
qi-botThe build has FAILED, see log here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/compile-log/openwrt-xburst.full_system-06132011-0721/01:42
wolfspraultuxbrain_away: for my atben/atusb order, do you have some stuff you need to ship back to Taipei? Maybe some returned nanos, or even more important, the jtag-serial pods from your m1 and hopefully the ones you got from h:d?02:12
wolfspraulI would like to combine it all into one shipment you can send with a good courier...02:13
wolfspraulI'll send you a mail :-)02:13
toenailHi, I have an Intel d915pcy Motherboard, and the front panel (in particular: the Firewire por) is not working. I've downoaded the manual and connected everything correct.02:15
toenailI've also check Intel's site for a 1394 driver, and nothing. I also, updated the Bios software,and yet, nothing02:16
DocScrutinizershouldn't the channel's /topic be a *bit* more specific, and also have some URL to a relevant website?03:18
wpwraklarsc: hmm, does 6960c45fc0eefbd9ae025fe35121e7eb4efd2bfb (in jz-2.6.38) have any known issues besides what you fixed in 7968eee8c23b92d5a6b064dc020f7397e6016421 ?03:18
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: yes, good point!03:19
wpwraklarsc: i seem to have a regression (USB doesn't enumerate anymore) that points to this. not entirely sure yet, though03:19
DocScrutinizerI mean, freenode users picking channels from chanlist based on what's in the /topic03:22
DocScrutinizerso a bit more descriptive topic wouldn't really hurt03:22
wolfspraulwe need a super short explanation what copyleft hw is03:23
wolfspraul"copyleft hardware is built out of free knowledge"?03:23
wpwrakhow about "HHHH0HzH.HxHxHHHh.oHzHH0HH" ? at least tuxbrain will find it exceedingly descriptive ;-)03:24
DocScrutinizerkeep in mind that most IRC clients allow searching chanlist incl topics by regex03:25
DocScrutinizerso a few buzzwords would help as well03:25
wolfspraulsure, like I said let's find something and change it03:26
DocScrutinizer"hardware hackers join here to discuss Ben NanoNote and other community driven hw projects"03:26
wolfspraulsure why not. I need to find out how to change the topic...03:29
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: don't you have those topic-changing superpowers already?03:29
DocScrutinizertoss a text to c&p ;-)03:33
DocScrutinizerit's "your" chan03:34
mthwpwrak: this might fix the USB problem: https://github.com/mthuurne/opendingux-kernel/commit/e6ec57a403:34
wpwrakmth: thanks ! now .. how do i cherry-pick this one ...03:37
DocScrutinizerwhere's he gone?03:37
wpwrakah, google knows. as usual ;-)03:37
DocScrutinizerlost while searching how to change topic?03:38
wpwrakexcept that there doesn't seem to be a way to pick from a repository without cloning it. grmbl ...03:39
mthas a last resort, you could copy-paste the diff and apply it03:39
mththe web page seems to be designed with that in mind: it doesn't select the line numbers03:39
DocScrutinizerwpwrak: URL for topic?03:39
mtha download link for the patch would be more useful though03:40
mthwpwrak: http://www.treewalker.org/temp/usb.patch03:41
wpwrakmth: thanks a lot !03:42
wpwrakwhee ! there we ride again !03:49
wpwrakmth: works great, thanks a lot !03:49
DocScrutinizerstill waiting for suggestions/critics about chan topic :-)04:17
qi-bot[commit] kyak: Revert "config.full_system: add liballegro stuff into image (=y>, not as module (=m)" http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/07fdef005:10
rjeffriesDocScrutinizer the chan topic reads fine IMO05:21
DocScrutinizerrjeffries: OK05:23
kyaktuxbrain_away: huh? 5 minutes ago AtBEN-AtUSB Combo was 59 EUR05:29
kyaknow it is 50 EUR05:29
kyakshould i wait another 5 minutes? :)05:30
kyakah, 5 minutes ago i wasn't registered.. That's interesting05:30
tuxbrain_awaywith vat without vat :)05:30
tuxbrain_awaydue you are from out side of EU vat doesn't apply :)05:31
tuxbrain_awayRusian and Southamerican people please wait until this night I update the shippin cost to you via fedex05:32
kyaki'll be waiting impatiently05:32
kyaki'll be saving 9 euro, this makes be wanna buy two :)05:33
kyaktuxbrain_away: how many did you produce?05:33
kyakwpwrak: can one atusb handle two atben's simultaneously?05:35
kyakwpwrak: and, can two atben's communicate between each other?05:36
wpwrakkyak: yes. yes.05:37
kyakgood, good :)05:38
wpwrakkyak: i'm not even sure where the maxium size of a PAN is. could be ~2^16 nodes. or maybe ~2^64.05:39
wpwrakkyak: in any case, there are not enough atben/atusb in the world to overflow even a single PAN ;-)05:40
wpwraknot are there ben, for that matter. including the ones still in wolfgang's warehouse :)05:40
kyakthere is even not enough living things on Earth to overflow it :)05:43
kyakbrowsing tuxbrain's shop, i stumbled upon EFIKA MX Smartbook. It's interesting05:44
xiangfujust read one news about JZ4770: ftp://ftp.ingenic.cn/2soc/4770/JZ4770_ds.pdf06:27
xiangfu1Ghz, 65nm06:28
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: cool, you already changed the topic it seems!06:30
wolfspraulwe can also shorten it and remove the relatively meaningless 'time is on our side' meme06:30
DocScrutinizerwolfspraul: like that?06:45
wolfspraulhow about you?06:45
wolfspraulalso remove the 'welcome and please ask your question...'?06:45
wolfspraula bit cheesy maybe06:45
wolfspraulwhat do you think?06:45
DocScrutinizerI think it's ok, maybe missing buzzwords like milkymist?06:46
wolfspraulDocScrutinizer: thanks a lot!06:46
DocScrutinizerno problem06:46
wolfspraulthere's actually the #milkymist channel as well06:46
wolfspraulthe overlap (or non-overlap) between #qi-hardware and #milkymist is not 100% clea06:46
wolfspraulwhich is OK I think06:46
wolfspraul#qi-hardware for me remains about copylef hardware, manufacturing, etc.06:47
wolfspraul#milkymist is definitely about the SoC, and then about Flickernoise (there is no separate flickernoise channel)06:47
wolfspraulit's also about Milkymist One, the video synthesizer, although somewhere there on the manufacturing side it starts to become part of the qi project :-)06:48
wolfspraulbottom line: no need to mention milkymist in the topic06:48
wolfspraulI think what you have now is perfect06:48
dvdkcurrently writing  a slashdot submission for atben/atusb07:05
dvdkwondering, what's the driver status?  still much work to do?07:05
dvdk(6lopan kernel drivers)07:06
wolfsprauldvdk: oh nice! crossing my fingers that you have some genius ideas for the headline :-)07:39
wolfspraulwithout speaking for Werner, I think on the driver side there is still a lot to do07:39
wolfspraulto get all this clean and into kernel.org, I think that's a whole new effort, maybe comparable in size to where Werner and Tuxbrain got things today07:41
wolfspraulStefan Schmidt has signaled some support, which is encouraging. So maybe the Slashdot headline should be a call for participation?07:41
wolfspraulbut what's the catchiest way to describe why this is important...07:41
wolfspraul802.15.4? 6LoWPAN? why?07:42
dvdkwolfspraul: sorry didn't catch your reply until it was submitted07:52
dvdkanybody with slashdot accounts wish to mod it up?  07:52
dvdkbut going into sw details would have been to verbose for a slashdot story anyways.07:53
wolfspraulyour headline gives a nice reason already07:53
dvdk(low attention span of slashdot readers :)07:53
dvdkthe ben-wpan wiki page is pretty large.  hopefully it can survive the slashdot effect07:54
dvdkouch. should have linked to a perma-link (i.e. dated version) of the page.07:54
dvdkwell, let's see how it goes. 07:55
wolfspraulI clicked on '+' - does this help?07:56
wolfspraul'replacement' is good, a bit radical like 'abuse' last time...07:56
wolfspraulI somehow can't see any effect of me clicking on '+', even though I'm logged in with my account.07:57
dvdkwolfspraul: the only effect is, that the '+' gets marked for you07:59
dvdkmaybe sd editors are going to see the number of '+' counts (but nobody else sees them)07:59
wolfspraulah I see08:01
dvdkyou prefer radical ?   "Qi-hardware tries to killing propritary wlan" :)08:01
wolfspraulwell then08:01
wolfspraulno no08:01
dvdk*to kill08:01
wolfspraulhold that back for later, ok?08:01
dvdkalways a question of audience, isn't it :)08:02
DocScrutinizersold OM's bq27k kernel module to meego-arm09:44
DocScrutinizerit's a pity how few of that stuff gone upstream. The effect is now other really crappy shit is occupying that niche09:45
DocScrutinizerwhich basically means the good OM stuff will never aver make it upstream now09:45
DocScrutinizerand eventually this will bite our ass for the local build, when crap comes back downstream and collides09:47
Action: DocScrutinizer curses OE09:48
whitequarkthe downstream of crap...09:52
wpwrak(keeping a low profile) "revolutionary WPAN frees universe from the shackles of the Wifi-industrial complex, heralds new golden age"10:11
wpwrakwolfspraul: (sw) yes, still a lot to do10:12
wpwrak(checking the article ...)10:13
wpwrakdjvdk: "compatability" .. intentional ? someone once suggested "combatablity", because it's always a fight :)10:14
wpwraka number of capitalization errors, e.g., it'e 6LoWPAN. also, the capitalization of atben/atusb should be just that. (hmm, but i see where you got the bad precedent from :-( )10:15
wpwrakhmm, would have been good to wait a bit with the announcement until after cleaning up the (very messy) wiki page ...10:19
wpwraktuxbrain_away: and you didn't update the commercial description. ("24 kB used")10:19
dvdkwpwrak: next time we should edit /. submission as a wiki page like community news :)10:23
dvdkwrt spelling: just used copy-pasted, yeah 6LowPAN is a my mistake10:23
wpwrakdvdk: yes, or at least have a quick review cycle10:23
dvdki thought: why review, if we can just re-submit over and over again? :)10:24
dvdkeverybod his/her own version of the story10:24
wpwrakoh dear ;-)10:24
DocScrutinizerok, nm. bq27k driver is upstream, according to our kernel hacker larsc 10:28
qi-bot[commit] Benson Leung: gpio-charger: Add gpio_charger_resume http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/0b8eee212:07
qi-bot[commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: udc http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/ef7f1fc12:07
qi-bot[commit] Lars-Peter Clausen: jz4740: Fix compile error http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/1c110d712:07
qi-bot[commit] Maarten ter Huurne: MIPS: JZ4740: USB: Fix packet read/write functions. http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/29cacc912:07
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: at86rf230: move register and protocol definitions to header file http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/b21308812:07
qi-bot[commit] Werner Almesberger: at86rf230: remove irq_disabled flag and clean up IRQ freeing http://qi-hw.com/p/qi-kernel/41fca6412:07
wolfsprauldvdk: I stole your text http://lists.en.qi-hardware.com/pipermail/announce/2011-June/000006.html12:09
wolfspraulunfortunately I forgot to fix the line wrappings, oh well :-)12:09
wolfspraulthe power of copy/paste got me12:09
dvdkwolfspraul: at least you fixed all the typos :)12:10
wpwrakwolfspraul: hmm, should mention that this is with EU taxes. abroad, these come off. (and local ones get added)12:11
wpwraktuxbrain_away: would be nice if your shop always mentioned what price it's showing (e.g., "with 18% IVA - click here for non-EU prices" or "without taxes - click here for EU prices")12:14
wolfspraulwpwrak: yes but I just wanted to get the news out asap, and if price comes down, even better12:15
wolfspraulI should have seen the line wraps at least...12:15
wpwrakwolfspraul: Jane will like the long line ;-)12:16
kristianpaulwow, that anoucement was fast :-)13:56
kristianpaulwpwrak: dirtpan support comunication between one or more atben/atusb ?16:04
wpwrakkristianpaul: at the moment, it doesnt' support atusb because the kernel doesn't. but once that it solved, it will, yes.16:06
wpwrakkristianpaul: in fact, it will support communication between any pairs of IEEE 802.15.4 devices that have a kernel driver16:07
qi-bot[commit] David Kühling: cmake.mk: fix bogus values for FIND_ROOT_PATH_MODE_*; kept plplot from compiling http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-xburst/e1cbfbf16:07
kristianpauloh, thats even better :-)16:07
kristianpaulwpwrak: u mean atusb support will be in linux upstream?16:08
kristianpaulthat will be awesome 16:08
wpwrakkristianpaul: i can't make such a promise. but i'm working on getting the driver ready for merging in richard's usb skeleton.16:10
rjeffrieswpwrak what do you think of this tool, for the money?18:05
GNUtoorjeffries, what about the FLOSS one?18:21
GNUtoofrom seed studio18:21
rjeffriesare the specs similar?18:22
GNUtoono idea18:22
GNUtooah I don't find it anymore18:24
GNUtoohmmm but they seem to have that:18:25
GNUtoono idea about the specs18:25
samgeeI just read the AtBEN announcement. Awesome news. Big thank you to wpwrak, tuxbrain_away and anyone else who made (and is still making) it happen. I hope we can support this work in gNewSenses soon.18:40
Jay7nice idea to use NN as wallet :)18:41
Jay7I'll prefer to have there OPIE/SKEY calculator and some secured storage18:42
Jay7and password generator (apg?)18:42
Jay7then we may position NN as banking e-token ;)18:43
Jay7connect it via USB, enter password and get access to your online banking :)18:43
Jay7$99 only :)18:43
Jay7iirc, e-tokens here are selled to customers about $5018:44
Jay7comparable price :)18:44
DocScrutinizerrjeffries: the ad gave me LULZ19:27
rjeffriesok I do not know enough to judge19:27
DocScrutinizer"gobbledigobble"  "send it over!"  "jokus pokus" "WUT??"19:27
kristianpaulsamgee: hey :-)19:28
kristianpaulsamgee: sure, i was about to point in gns, add support for atusb at least19:29
DocScrutinizerrjeffries: I missed any pricetag for that 8ch-logprobe19:32
samgeekristianpaul: it'd be nice if we could be early adopters for support, but probably not feasible in the short term.19:41
qwebirc625Hello! Does any of you know how could I get a nano-note here in Argentina?19:44
kristianpaulmay be wpwrak have some nanonote avaliable to sell? :-)19:46
kristianpaulbut in the wort case you have to order from sharism19:46
qwebirc625oh! Thanks a lot Kristian!20:09
qwebirc625(btw, Werner does not have any available to sell it :( )20:09
qwebirc625then, Sharism20:10
wpwrak(selling stuff) yup. argentine biz bureaucrazy is way too messy for me to get into. well, if there was demand for 1000+ units per month, maybe :)20:49
qi-bot[commit] David Kühling: add icon and starter for ASE (aseprite) image/animation editor http://qi-hw.com/p/gmenu2x/31e1f3c21:13
qi-bot[commit] David Kühling: ase: hack gui to emulate mouse via keyboard; change keymap to not interfere. http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/5c9e2b821:52
wpwraktuxbrain_away: any news on the sugru front ? pass or fail ? :)22:53
tuxbrain_awayI have let my already setup NN to victor to make pretty pics on NN , and I have other more urgent work to do than seting up a new NN to test the sugru thing, I will test as soon as my NN come back22:54
tuxbrain_awaypics on NN atben and atusb of course :)22:55
wpwraktuxbrain_away: (pis) great !22:59
wpwrak(pis being a particularly bad typo in spanish ;-)23:00
tuxbrain_awayyeah on first read before the typo correction I was thinking you where celebrating a great toilet achievement that want to share with me23:08
wpwraksometimes, right after them, the feel very much like worth celebrating. but no, i haven't thought of sharing my exploits on the throne here. maybe i should start a blog ;-)23:12
tuxbrain_awaynah a tweet or ident is just enough :P23:13
wpwrakwhen did i go. how did it feel and sound. how was my weight difference. what had i eaten before. picture for premium subscribers. oh yes, i could see a nice business model ;-)23:13
wpwrakyou have to go with the times. nobody cares about technology these days. a quick fart joke, yes, that's more than enough intellectual challenge for a day ;-)23:15
tuxbrain_awaytoo much information dude (what is the emoticon for extremelly disgusting near to throw up)23:18
tuxbrain_awaywpwrak: what was the aviable free mem? don't make me search on the list23:44
wpwraktuxbrain_away: alright, i searched it for you: http://pastebin.com/MnWG9Efw23:47
wpwrakthe relevant sentences are at the bottom :)23:48
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