| wpwrak | wolfspraul: ah, an idea for web improvements: a substitution that converts URLs like http://src.qi-hw.com/([^/]*)/(.*) into http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/$1/source/tree/master/$2 | 02:25 |
|---|---|---|
| wpwrak | wolfspraul: that would keep links to source a bit more sane | 02:26 |
| wolfspraul | he, nice idea | 02:34 |
| mth | sounds like a good idea, but should "master" be in the fixed part? | 02:38 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: konqueror does that with user defined services wp:wiki wpe:england #:man man ##:info man | 02:39 |
| mth | I mostly use qi-kernel, I don't know if that's an exception or not regarding the use of branches | 02:39 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: yeah, but posting browser-specific links would be a little mean, wouldn't it ? ;-) | 02:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | aaah you meant aliases on apache | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer | on maemo wiki I think there are a lot of thise | 02:41 |
| wpwrak | mth: i think in most cases, "master" should work fine. well, it maybe make it a project-specific standard branch, defaulting to "master" :) | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | why not /m/ instead /p/, for /m/aster? | 02:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | err nm | 02:42 |
| mth | wpwrak: project specific default branch is probably sufficient for 99% of the use cases | 02:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | srcm. for source/tree/master - src. for source/tree | 02:44 |
| mth | it might be harder to set up though than a hardcoded "master" | 02:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | so http://srcm.qi-hw.com/X/Y == http://src.qi-hw.com/X/master/Y | 02:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | nb second form is perfectly allowable with your regex | 02:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | $2=master/Y | 02:48 |
| mth | might be more complex than it's worth | 02:48 |
| mth | what about http://src.qi-hw.com/([^/]*)/(.*) -> http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/$1/source/tree/default/$2 -> http://projects.qi-hardware.com/index.php/p/$1/source/tree/master/$2 ? | 02:50 |
| mth | so implement the default branch as a redirect in PHP | 02:50 |
| mth | that might be easier in case the first step is done with mod_rewrite | 02:51 |
| mth | or some other configurable but not programmable module | 02:52 |
| wpwrak | dunno. implementation detail ;-) | 02:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: (uptime breakdown) only 7h, but do you think it caused a hangover that shows after 12h of being awake? | 02:54 |
| wolfspraul | DocScrutinizer: I read in the news about Nokia's forecast warning etc. That sounds ugly. | 02:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | *shrug* | 02:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | -15% | 02:55 |
| wolfspraul | I'm wondering what's happening. Massive exodus everywhere? | 02:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | stock exchange penalty | 02:55 |
| wpwrak | wolfspraul: nothing we didn't predict, did we ? :) | 02:55 |
| wolfspraul | hundreds of Nokia staff updating their linkedin profiles? | 02:55 |
| wolfspraul | distributors reallocating marketing resources to android? | 02:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | prolly | 02:56 |
| wolfspraul | employees checking which dates they need to reach to be entitled to certain benefits? | 02:56 |
| wpwrak | people considering symbian as "dead". and nokia has neither iphone nor android to offer, so they don't buy nokia smartphones. | 02:57 |
| wolfspraul | and what does it mean to meego? probably there is so much chaos inside nokia now that nothing comprehensive can come out anywhere :-) | 02:57 |
| wolfspraul | I was thinking about meeting with some Nokia execs I could get in touch with here in Beijing, but pushing it away for months. | 02:57 |
| wolfspraul | too much chaos there I feel, but maybe eventually I should still try... | 02:58 |
| wolfspraul | what we are doing would just be another distraction for Nokia right now | 02:58 |
| wolfspraul | I think they first have to plain survive | 02:58 |
| wpwrak | considering that MS make several dollars per android sold, i wonder if their "help" for nokia wasn't just a move to kill them more quickly, so that they don't disturb the profitable android ipr business | 02:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | wolfspraul: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-ssu-irclog/%23maemo-ssu.2011-05-31.log.html#t2011-05-31T23:28:13 | 02:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | >>I can't believe no-one's taken a pot shot at Elop yet<< [<-- Nokian] | 03:00 |
| wpwrak | the finns are generally nice and quiet people ... | 03:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: you're not the first one to think this | 03:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | seen a picture where balmer and elop shake hands, and somebody made elop say "mission accomplished" | 03:04 |
| mth | wpwrak: they're getting paid for Android phones by HTC, not for all Android phones (although they'll certainly try) | 03:04 |
| wpwrak | not "bwahahaha" ? ;-) | 03:04 |
| wolfspraul | yes but what does it mean for meego? | 03:05 |
| wolfspraul | are there any meego people that want to branch out and try to reboot in a startup outside? | 03:05 |
| wpwrak | mth: yup. was on heise recently. USD 5 per unit. even more from non-HTC, it seems. | 03:05 |
| DocScrutinizer | efectively nokia binned meego | 03:05 |
| wpwrak | wolfspraul: presumably, there are | 03:05 |
| wolfspraul | or they are all clinging to their comfy nokia positions as long as possible... | 03:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | there's no make-a-living in meego handset UX | 03:06 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: intel money ? | 03:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | Elop came from M$ and said "bend over, Nokia!", and Nokia asked "how far?" | 03:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: that's what I'm at atm | 03:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | they need a platform, before meego handset UX has *any* future | 03:09 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: (how far) do you really think they even talked back to them ? :) | 03:09 |
| wpwrak | grmbl. qi-hw list traffic for may at an all-time low. well, it can only get better ;-) | 03:10 |
| mth | maybe if Intel really wants to see an x86 phone they'll pay for that | 03:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: and Intel isn't directly involved or interested in meego HS-UX, as they don't sell phones | 03:11 |
| mth | if iOS and Android can be retrofitted from phone UI to phone + tablet UI, maybe MeeGo can go in the opposite direction? | 03:12 |
| mth | although going from less to more screen space is easier | 03:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | mth: that's my idea - Intel sponsoring development of a new open platform to build meego HSUX on it, then eventually they easily port to x86 and sell their crappy processors to phone manufs | 03:13 |
| mth | MeeGo is already running on both ARM and x86, isn't it? | 03:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's running on X86 tablets - the tablet UX | 03:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's not really running on ARM N900 | 03:15 |
| mth | more like crawling? | 03:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | and they are running short of N900s ;-D | 03:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | and no more support from Nokia | 03:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | not really | 03:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | as in "we insist on keeping battery management entity a closed blob" | 03:16 |
| mth | ah | 03:16 |
| DocScrutinizer | and last thing rumour has is the promised "meego device" actually is yet another maemo device, though crippled to look like it was meego | 03:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | aiui they want to call it "meego harmattan "Hybrid Edition" - and there's been hassle as they weren't allowed to use meego(R) for that | 03:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | </rumour> | 03:19 |
| mth | I'm wondering if I should buy one before it's no longer available or avoid it since it won't ever be properly supported | 03:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | N900? | 03:20 |
| mth | yes, or the new device | 03:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's a great hw, and maemo works reasonably well on it | 03:21 |
| DocScrutinizer | the "new device" seems to be a capacitive touchscreen one, and quality of hw kbd is still questionable | 03:21 |
| mth | I earn my salary with iOS, but it's too closed to buy for myself and jailbreaking is too much hassle with updates | 03:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | has a certain coolness factor anyway, but I probably don't like it | 03:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | esp with this "meego" on it | 03:22 |
| mth | I'm used to capacitive screens from Apple, the only problem is fingerprints | 03:22 |
| wpwrak | mth: wear gloves ! ;-) | 03:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | muhahaha | 03:23 |
| mth | it will have to be special gloves or it won't recognise the touches | 03:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | well, FCC disclose scheduled for 26th | 03:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | so we'll probably hear sth from nokia prior to that date | 03:24 |
| DocScrutinizer | a nokia tweet announced "something" for today | 03:25 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: elop retires ? ;) | 03:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | I#m afraid he won't | 03:26 |
| mth | I'm not in a hurry, I've still got a monochrome phone that does very little except calling and SMS, but after a battery replacement it lasts a week on a charge | 03:27 |
| wpwrak | why not ? the damage is pretty much done. you don't have to stay aboard to watch the ship sink. much nicer to do this from the beach of a nearby island ... | 03:27 |
| wpwrak | mth: the batteries are what i'll miss most about nokia ... you could get them anywhere, and they're nicely compatible with so many other things ... | 03:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | agreed, but you might want to make sure there's no new life coming up e.g from the small but vivid maemo/meego department | 03:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | hell, Nokians even appear on community channels and dare to talk about Elop pot shot and gamble with testing limits of their NDA | 03:30 |
| wpwrak | naw, even better to let them try to save the crashing misery and burn out in the process. they'd be much more dangerous with all the ballast. | 03:30 |
| wpwrak | s/with/without/ | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | starting to get involved into maemo(!) community seamless software update, the community driven successor of Nokia's maemo repository | 03:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | an unheard thin to happen with a Nokian kerneldev to date | 03:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | thing* | 03:32 |
| DocScrutinizer | and he agreed with me 100% about evil concept of polling in recent developments "upstream" | 03:34 |
| DocScrutinizer | I somewhat love that guy | 03:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-ssu-irclog/%23maemo-ssu.2011-05-31.log.html#t2011-05-31T17:59:58 | 03:36 |
| whitequark | i've just found myself using an SMD rework station to solder a LED with pins (to a pb-free board) | 04:07 |
| whitequark | that worked much better than trying to solder it with an iron. is that the method it should be really done? | 04:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | errr | 04:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | I never had a proper SMD rework station to play with ;-) | 04:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | kinda too expensive for a hobby tool used twice a year | 04:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | (my plans to establish a European Openmoko R&D and repair center nearby never panned out ;-D ) | 04:10 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: maybe calling it an "SMD rework station" was too encouraging. it's just a chinese heat gun | 04:10 |
| whitequark | combined with a good iron | 04:10 |
| whitequark | that was maybe just above $100 | 04:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | aaah | 04:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | I thought about a thing 100 times the price tag | 04:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | may 50 times | 04:11 |
| whitequark | wrong terms again :/ | 04:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | +be | 04:11 |
| whitequark | it's still very useful, through | 04:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | sure | 04:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | I got a pair of desoldering tweezers fro Taipei, friggin useful and was ~20$ | 04:12 |
| whitequark | desoldering tweezers, huh. can you show a link/photo? | 04:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmmm | 04:13 |
| whitequark | sounds weird to me | 04:13 |
| whitequark | ah yes, I've got it | 04:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www.mercateo.com/p/139A-4683614/SMD_DESOLDERING_TWEEZERS_Typ_226.html?showSimplePage=NO&utm_source=product-search&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=Entl(f6)tpinzette#xytronics-smd-desoldering-tweezers-typ-226-xytronics | 04:14 |
| whitequark | the thingy to desolder all those 0402 SMD passive elements | 04:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | exactly | 04:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | mere fun | 04:14 |
| whitequark | I prefer more... compact way | 04:15 |
| whitequark | just touch them with a side of iron | 04:15 |
| whitequark | and use plain tweezers | 04:15 |
| whitequark | works like a charm | 04:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | works as long as you have "free air" | 04:15 |
| whitequark | hm, right | 04:15 |
| DocScrutinizer | otherwise you easily desolder half your device at one time | 04:16 |
| whitequark | well, I never actually worked with elements less than 0805, 'cause the only shop I know which sells them from one part has a price tag of $0.3 per one | 04:17 |
| whitequark | and that turns into a lot for even a small board | 04:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | hehe | 04:19 |
| whitequark | 0805 are quite common and are easily bought in any quantities for nothing | 04:19 |
| vladkorotnev | hello everyone | 04:19 |
| whitequark | vlad, hi | 04:19 |
| DocScrutinizer | I got a whole "book" of beads, and one of R, if you're interested ;-) | 04:19 |
| Jay7 | kyak: looking on russian keyboard in news :) | 04:19 |
| vladkorotnev | could anyone please help me with compiling a package? | 04:20 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: I wonder if there is some chinese supplier which sells a package of 20x each of E14 series | 04:20 |
| Jay7 | kyak: imho phonetic layout may be easier to use | 04:20 |
| vladkorotnev | it fails with "mipsel-openwrt-linux-uclibc-ar: illegal option -- n" | 04:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | dunno, I guess the one I got is probably original chinese | 04:20 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: I've seen those things for 0805 here | 04:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | lemme have a look | 04:20 |
| DocScrutinizer | NOVA comp-card-system | 04:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: ^^^ | 04:23 |
| whitequark | hm, .de | 04:26 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: that's just a box, right? (Yes, it's a very good box, through, but I've already found one...) | 04:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | CORC-04 | 04:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www.nova-elektronik.de/compcards/chip0603.php | 04:28 |
| whitequark | ah, so they also sell them pre-filled | 04:29 |
| whitequark | that's interesting, thanks | 04:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: no idea if you can get anything like that over there, heard sending goods from western Europe is next to impossible | 04:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | possibly getting sth from China or dunno is easier, but you'll know better | 04:42 |
| Jay7 | it's just unpredictable :) | 04:42 |
| Jay7 | not impossible :) | 04:42 |
| whitequark | http://ebaytoday.ru has mail forwarding service in Germany | 04:43 |
| whitequark | so that will be easy, through quite expensive at all | 04:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | sending an N900 from Nokia to paul fertser turned out to be a mission impossible, finally ru customs asked for more monney to *proceed* the package than the whole device been worth | 04:44 |
| Jay7 | hehe | 04:44 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: iirc N900 costs more than 10000 RUR, and there is some stupid customs limit in that order | 04:46 |
| Jay7 | it's always safer to use some relative | 04:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | after DHL returned the package in warshaw or somewhere as they noticed the addr as given in accordance to what helsinki DHL said it has to look like wasn't "deliverable" - ""no pkg delivery to private person, only to companies"" | 04:46 |
| whitequark | I've only used airmail to date, and it was fine, through _extremely_ slow | 04:47 |
| Jay7 | whitequark: now that limit is raised | 04:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | Paul gave addr of his university or sth, and in Warshaw they noticed that's not good enough | 04:47 |
| Jay7 | iirc, about $1000 | 04:47 |
| Jay7 | DocScrutinizer: DHL is courier delivery, they have other law :) | 04:48 |
| whitequark | because of that, ebaytoday even recommends lying in the customs declaration (not to mention they explicitly recommend _not_ to write that apple products are inside, because the package might get stolen otherwise) | 04:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | and stupid Nokia was unable to send any other way than DHL :-/ | 04:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | My suggestion to send the device to me and I'll forward it didn't fly for some odd reason | 04:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | I think finally Paul got a used devel device from another developer in Moskow, and the Nokia-sent N900 probably vanished at customs :-P | 04:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | darn, that has cost me some weeks of my life | 04:52 |
| Jay7 | DocScrutinizer: imagine what does it cost for people here.. | 04:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | probably worse an experience than all the TI OMAP3430 datasheet studying ;-P | 04:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | but it resulted in N900 h-e-n usb-hostmode finally, one way or the other | 04:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | so maybe been worth it | 04:54 |
| Jay7 | hm.. | 04:55 |
| Jay7 | I definitely should provide some info on my site about jay-tech.de... | 04:55 |
| Action: Jay7 have site jay-tech.ru | 04:55 | |
| Jay7 | some people with jay-tech's products are going to my site to ask some questions :) | 04:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | related to jay-7ech ? ;-) | 04:55 |
| Jay7 | DocScrutinizer: yeah :) | 04:56 |
| Jay7 | my nickname in RusNet is Jay w/o 7 :) | 04:56 |
| Jay7 | so that's my tech ;) | 04:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | what's about that site? | 04:56 |
| Jay7 | IT for SOHO business | 04:57 |
| Jay7 | consulting/solutions/etc | 04:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | mhm | 04:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | sounds strangely familiar | 04:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | I couldn't have run into jay-tech.de incidentally | 05:00 |
| Jay7 | jay-tech.de producing some devices like cameras and netbooks | 05:00 |
| Jay7 | I've two calls one time about netbook problems :) | 05:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | though I think I've seen products like cameras labeled jay-tech | 05:01 |
| Jay7 | jay-tech's production is very popular because of germany duty-free :) | 05:03 |
| Jay7 | they are cheap there | 05:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | yeah, dirt cheap | 05:03 |
| Jay7 | but after all they have no support out of germany | 05:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's what I think I recall about jay-tech products | 05:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | cheap silver plastic | 05:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | "video camera" with 128MB storage, things like this | 05:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | the stuff the advertise at homeshopping TV channels, at 3'o in the night | 05:07 |
| Jay7 | :) | 05:08 |
| Action: whitequark has just got to fix USB-SATA enclosure bought in Britain: a pad for the SATA connector was missing completely | 05:08 | |
| whitequark | and there ever was a Q.C.Passed label | 05:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | LL | 05:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | LOL | 05:09 |
| Action: DocScrutinizer needs to vacuum his kbd :-S | 05:09 | |
| whitequark | ah yes, they've "fixed" it | 05:10 |
| whitequark | with a thing I overlooked as a solder bridge | 05:10 |
| whitequark | a week ago I've seen a chinese hard drive enclosure. they've put in a small package with four screws, and even a small screwdriver | 05:14 |
| whitequark | now the fun part: the case was made in a way which completely prevented access to the mounting holes | 05:14 |
| whitequark | i.e. it was composed of two parts glued together nicely, one in another, and the inner one had the holes. | 05:15 |
| kyak | Jay7: heh, in fact, this (cyrillic layout) has been implemented months ago :) I just made a nice picture of keyboard in recent days | 05:28 |
| kyak | Jay7: and yeah, i've been thinking about phonetic layout for quite some time now, just didn't lay my hands on it yet :) | 05:29 |
| kyak | phonetic layout or engraving? :) | 05:29 |
| Jay7 | kyak: I mean layout | 05:29 |
| kyak | i mean, this is what i'm thinkinh | 05:30 |
| Jay7 | then you may live w/o engraving :) | 05:30 |
| Jay7 | I have some xmodmap's for zaurus | 05:30 |
| Jay7 | with phonetic layout | 05:30 |
| kyak | a proposal from someone who already using phonetic layout would be helpful. I mean, where exactly to put 7 (33-26) cyrillic letters. | 05:32 |
| kyak | a picture or keymap | 05:32 |
| Jay7 | kyak: I'll look | 05:41 |
| vladkorotnev | could someone help me with this? | 06:19 |
| vladkorotnev | http://pastie.org/2001999 | 06:19 |
| kyak | obviously a problem in Install section of your Makefile | 06:21 |
| vladkorotnev | kyak: PM | 06:22 |
| qi-bot | [commit] Xiangfu Liu: new package: crashmail: CrashMail II is basically http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/db4f174 | 08:54 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: hmm, i suck at electromagnetism. if I run a probe wire for a few cm in parallel to one wire of a mains cable (220 Vac, let's say Iac = 1 A), distance limited by isolation, so maybe 2 mm center to center, will i be able to pick up any perceptible energy that way ? | 09:15 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: once I've played with my scope and it probably picked up some voltage in range of millivolts in a similar case | 09:27 |
| whitequark | I'm not completely sure through, that might be caused by some other effect | 09:28 |
| wpwrak | whitequark: that would be a few pA then, if it was that | 09:30 |
| wpwrak | err no, even nA. luxury ! ;-) | 09:30 |
| whitequark | wpwrak: again, that sounds doubtfully for me. maybe I'm worrong. | 09:36 |
| whitequark | *wrong | 09:37 |
| kyak | xMff: hi! Did you have any luck fighting that *-dev automagic in OpenWrt? | 10:24 |
| xMff | kyak: not yet, got swamped with work related stuff | 10:25 |
| kyak | i see, the summer started good :) | 10:27 |
| xMff | well... sales and management demand crazy stuff | 10:27 |
| xMff | the usual corporate insanity | 10:28 |
| kyak | if my experience tells right, this is going to ramp down soon.. till the end of summer | 10:28 |
| xMff | ;) | 10:34 |
| kristianpaul | "Remove the CPU microcode and see whether your BIOS will run at all." he :-) | 11:03 |
| zear | hey guys | 11:45 |
| kyak | hey zear | 11:55 |
| heberth | kristianpaul: que pasa con liure? | 14:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: you bet you will :-) | 15:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: e.g. it's pretty enough energy to make a LCD display operate | 15:56 |
| kyak | could it be? | 15:56 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: oh, wow. i didn't expect it to be nearly that strong. | 15:57 |
| wpwrak | DocScrutinizer: do you know how (i.e., keywords for google ;) i could find some circuit (schematics) that does things with this sort of energy harvesting ? | 15:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | there are those voltprobe "screwdrivers" that have a LCD instead of a gas discharge lamp. You can follow AC wires in the wall with them | 15:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | of course each true wirefinder does the trick with a few transistors | 15:59 |
| DocScrutinizer | plus batery and piezobeeper/LED | 16:00 |
| wpwrak | great. so they even work for wires where current goes both ways. is this still induction they use ? i thought the fields would roughly cancel each other out | 16:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | capacitive coupling | 16:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | those don't detect current, they detect voltage | 16:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | current of some A will detectable as well, but not with a single ended wire | 16:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | asymmetrics | 16:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | it's not exactly twisted-pair | 16:04 |
| wpwrak | yeah, i was thinking of inductive coupling | 16:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | inductive works for all asymmetric detectors, i.e. it won't help to wind a wire around the cable but you may place a coil *beneath* the cable | 16:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | 1000BT must not run in parallel to AC wires | 16:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | ;-) | 16:14 |
| vladkorotnev | hello everyone :P | 16:37 |
| qi-bot | The build was successfull, see images here: http://fidelio.qi-hardware.com/~xiangfu/compile-log/openwrt-xburst.full_system-05312011-0348/ | 16:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: if you'd elaborate after what you are exactly, I'd probably be able to help more specifically | 17:00 |
| DocScrutinizer | wpwrak: if you have access to a single wire, you quite usually use a coil wound on a toroid that can get opened to grip around the wire to test | 17:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | commonly known as "Zangen-Amperemeter" | 17:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zangenamperemeter | 17:08 |
| DocScrutinizer | NB the toroid can be of any size, shape, and a variety of ferromagnetic materials | 17:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | OTOH there MUST NOT be any cables or even pipes in parallel to lighting conductor wires. And - as mentioned above - ethernet cabling mustn't run in parallel to power cables with less than 20cm distance | 17:17 |
| DocScrutinizer | inductive coupling is a reality ;-) | 17:18 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zangenamperemeter#Sonderausf.C3.BChrung_f.C3.BCr_mehradrige_Leitungen ;-D | 17:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stromsensor | 17:22 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Datei:Platinen-stromsensor.svg&filetimestamp=20081113205542 | 17:23 |
| DocScrutinizer | cool (didn't know yet): http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stromsensor#Nutzung_des_Faraday-Effektes | 17:26 |
| whitequark | there's some discussion of pulseaudio on the mailing list | 17:49 |
| whitequark | was someone able to start it on ben? | 17:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | lol, PA | 18:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | pukeaudio | 18:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | we recently found out PA << ALSA and ever was, and even fans of PA had no better argument why we need this cruft at all, other than "I like it" | 18:55 |
| DocScrutinizer | we found not a *single* argument/feature that would suggest PA is a better solution for any particular problem | 18:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | ALSa can do literally all that PA claims to do, and usually ALSA is better on it | 18:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | only problem of ALSA being it's been a development sponsored and driven by SuSE, and obviously not may of the other esp debian-based distros bothered to properly integrate it so it'd work OOTB without user twiddling with its setting a bit | 18:59 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: there's several things I love pulseaudio for: ability to change sound level _and_ audio sink for each application in a nice gui | 19:01 |
| whitequark | hm, okay, one thing. | 19:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | au contraire jacekowski pointed out PA forces him to do mixing in SW eating up CPU cycles for nothing, while his soundblaster audiocard is well capable of full hw mixing | 19:01 |
| whitequark | I consider it as an acceptable tradeoff for an ability of fine-tuning sound output | 19:02 |
| DocScrutinizer | and HW mixing is and even been supported by ALSA | 19:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | please don't get me going, just believe me there's an ALSA way to do that, since eternity | 19:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | for all the points you might want to rise | 19:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | there's softvol in ALSA | 19:04 |
| whitequark | I'd be really happy if someone wrote a handy tool for managing that. currently it only exists for PA, and that's why I use it | 19:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | there's been mixing in ALSA since 1999, though most isers thought ALSA can't do that at all | 19:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | uh? tool for using softvol??? | 19:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | mompls... | 19:06 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/twinklephone/message/1731 | 19:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | can't get more handy, as it's fully ntegrated into what soundcard micer always been like | 19:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | mixer* | 19:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | so no, there's actually no tool for that, as you don't need any | 19:08 |
| whitequark | hm... | 19:10 |
| whitequark | well, okay, it is possible with alsa, fine. | 19:11 |
| whitequark | but I don't want to mess with scripts, I want just to move a slider and that's it | 19:11 |
| whitequark | why wasn't it integrated to alsamixer? | 19:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | and I'm away -as I'm not interested in another debate about it | 19:12 |
| whitequark | okay. | 19:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | that IS just a slider btw, the script is a run-once script to setup your system correctly | 19:12 |
| whitequark | so it should be run once per app? | 19:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | no, once per lifetime of your system | 19:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | then you just need to select correct audio device for your app ant that's it | 19:14 |
| whitequark | then it's really cool, thanks | 19:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | o/ | 19:14 |
| whitequark | no more pulseaudio :) | 19:14 |
| whitequark | I wonder why isn't it in default alsa packages | 19:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | see above, there's a lot missing in ALSA OOTB config, in other than SuSE distros. This softvol config though is my baby and not even found there | 19:34 |
| whitequark | it definitely should be included | 19:35 |
| DocScrutinizer | how to use: you add the pcm.vol { } definition to your alsa config in ~/.asoundrc or /etc/asound.conf , then instead of doing e.g >> aplay -D dolby5.1 mysong.wav << you simply do >> aplay -D vol:songs,dolby5.1 << and ALSA will create a slider "songs" showing up in all mixers, for your convenience | 19:40 |
| whitequark | and what if I want e.g. to use Chromium this way? | 19:41 |
| whitequark | or pidgin or <insert a gui app here> | 19:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | err missed the mysong.wav parameter in second cmd | 19:41 |
| DocScrutinizer | if it's a sane app it has a way to configure the audio device | 19:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | you simply change the audio device as described above | 19:42 |
| whitequark | sadly, most apps aren't | 19:42 |
| whitequark | maybe there is an environment var or such | 19:42 |
| whitequark | like ALSA_DEFAULT_DEVICE | 19:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | then you need to override the audiodevice that the app is using, generally "default" | 19:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | replace pcm.vol { by pcm.!deafult { , and instead of >>default "jOERG" << you use sth like >>default $getenv {fsckupaudioapp} << [you need to fix this, it's definitely syntactically incorrect] - then start the app via >> fsckdupaudioapp=MySliderName MyFsckdupAppBinary<< and fine you are | 19:46 |
| whitequark | impressive. I never knew that alsa configs are so powerful | 19:47 |
| whitequark | okay, I've ran your script (without twinkle stuff at bottom), then did "sox bsg_the_music.mp3 -t alsa vol:songs", and it fails with "sox FAIL formats: can't open output file `vol:songs': snd_pcm_hw_params_any error: Invalid argument" | 19:49 |
| whitequark | what should I also replace in generated .asoundrc? | 19:49 |
| whitequark | (I've just added "card 0;" line) | 19:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | or - way simpler: pcm.!default { slave $getenv FUrealAdio} and start the app with >> FUrealAudio=vol:MySliderName,default MyApp << | 19:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | sorry I'm in a bit of a pinch, came back as I've forgotten my phone ;-D, and would like to help you later, if you just pastebin your ~/.asoundrc and terminal session c&p | 19:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | also a aplay -L and aplay -l | 19:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | bbl | 19:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | o/ | 19:53 |
| whitequark | DocScrutinizer: http://pastie.org/2005092 | 19:57 |
| whitequark | may I ask why do you use uclibc and not eglibc? the latter is not significantly fatter (maybe ~200k bigger), but you'll get much more compatible libc | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | whitequark: aplay -vv -D vol:songs -f s16_le </dev/zero | 21:13 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://paste.debian.net/118627/ | 21:15 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | "à la mode" computing is depressing | 23:46 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | Smartphones, social websites, cloud computing, I really can't get used or like all of theses things. Is it wrong or what ? | 23:47 |
| wolfspraul | people are different I guess | 23:49 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | Oh, and I forgot "moder desktops" | 23:50 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | (understand "gnome 3" | 23:50 |
| wolfspraul | some like to hang out in boring jobs, kill downtime during office hours clicking on facebook etc, play computer games once they finally get home at night, etc. | 23:50 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | modern* | 23:50 |
| wolfspraul | but not all do :-) | 23:50 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | Hehe | 23:50 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | I'm not sad about all of this but I'm seriously curious about all of this | 23:51 |
| wolfspraul | yeah but I think it's because we value things differently | 23:51 |
| wolfspraul | you don't even need to start with religions to realize that | 23:51 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | Things are changing so fast. When I was a kid, my comrades at school were picking on me for liking computers... now if you don't have the latest smartphone you're a looser. | 23:51 |
| wolfspraul | some people happily spend 20 years of their life paying off expensive real estate in the expensive metropolitan area they live in | 23:52 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | wolfspraul, you described it perfectly. I'm too picky when it comes to computers. | 23:52 |
| wolfspraul | others move to the mid-west and buy more property for 10% of the price :-) | 23:52 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | Yeah I see | 23:52 |
| wolfspraul | (mid-west as a US concept, but the same is true all over the world) | 23:52 |
| wolfspraul | and the ones hanging out on their ranch are scratching their heads over what the ones in downtown whatever are doing, and vice-versa | 23:53 |
| wolfspraul | who says that you are a looser without the latest smartphone? | 23:54 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | wolfspraul, noone is saying this to me don't worry ;) | 23:54 |
| wolfspraul | not worrying | 23:55 |
| wolfspraul | maybe you think too much | 23:55 |
| wolfspraul | :-) | 23:55 |
| wolfspraul | maybe actually not many people would say somthing like that | 23:55 |
| wolfspraul | they can try with me, I will smile and take another sip of my coffee | 23:55 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | But it's in the mind of the people around me. Like, buying a tablet because you have to... but still no one knows what the hell you can do with it. | 23:55 |
| wolfspraul | I think if you walk around with an ipad now that's pretty embarassing | 23:55 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | (I still don't know what I would do with a tablet too) | 23:56 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | Haha | 23:56 |
| wolfspraul | it's similar to a (real) Louis Vuitton bag | 23:56 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | It's just the size but I've seen people doing so | 23:56 |
| wolfspraul | so you just put the ipad inside (let it peek out a little) to complete the 'look' | 23:56 |
| wolfspraul | seriously that's all | 23:56 |
| wolfspraul | the bag is 1000 USD, why shouldn't the stylish acessory that peeks out a little be 500 USD as well | 23:56 |
| wolfspraul | fine by me | 23:57 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | haha | 23:57 |
| wolfspraul | seriously | 23:57 |
| wolfspraul | hookers also love them | 23:57 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | I'm not saying all of this is good wolfspraul neither that I want to do like all of theses people. | 23:57 |
| wolfspraul | I guess you can ask for a higher price because you come across as a more high-class hooker if you have an ipad at starbucks, rather than a pesky smartphone | 23:57 |
| wolfspraul | then I see a lot of regular folks with ipads on subway and bus commutes | 23:58 |
| wolfspraul | I will watch how long they do that, looks quite tiring to me | 23:58 |
| wolfspraul | my estimate is: 6 months | 23:58 |
| wolfspraul | but why not? | 23:58 |
| wolfspraul | I do nothing, I just enjoy the ride and look out the window. | 23:59 |
| wolfspraul | or in the subway I guess look at other people, hehe :-) | 23:59 |
| lunavorax_frizzl | :) | 23:59 |
| --- Thu Jun 2 2011 | 00:00 | |
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