#qi-hardware IRC log for Saturday, 2011-04-02

wpwrakwolfspraul: phew. 1st of april news ... shouldn't they really be something like 3rd of april news ? with the 1st being poisoned by april fools jokes and the 2nd still toxic with the ones that came a bit too late, all too easy in the modern globalized world.01:06
wolfspraulwpwrak: that was exactly my thinking last night when I was frustrated that I had to do the whole cleanup work again :-)01:21
wolfspraulso yes, let them be april 4 news (Monday)01:21
wolfsprauli'll work on it today a bit...01:21
wpwrakexcellent ! great minds DO think alike :)01:23
wpwrakit's been an odd month. lots at or around the beginning, then fairly quiet for the rest01:23
wolfspraulthe problem will be to extract the real news, together with good pics01:26
wolfspraulas always01:26
wolfspraulyes there is a lot of activity here and there. but what is the point? what is the bottom line? what matters?01:26
wpwraki think the mailing list tends to get most of the long-term-important things01:27
wpwraksometimes a bit of noise too, but that's normal01:27
wpwrakregarding pics, you mentioned that you edit them for size and such. the ones i make are usually sized for efficient online viewing. is that format convenient for you ? i also keep the originals, but i don't advertize them01:29
wolfspraulhmm01:31
wolfspraulin general I would upload the highest resolution possible somewhere, just for archival purposes01:31
wolfspraulmediawiki will scale automatically, that solves the 'online viewing' problem01:31
wpwrakthe editing i do is usually cropping and gamma correction. occasionally also white balance or more complex contrast than just gamma. once or twice actual retouching. (e.g., for one of the antennas plus chair pictures, the contrast was just unbearable and i did some fairly thorough editing. it still looks crappy, but at least prettier crap ;-)01:32
wolfspraulI don't see any print magazine interested in publishing things right now, that's the only real reason for higher res pictures01:32
wolfsprauland print magazines would not only be picky about resolution, most likely they would be picky about the actual image quality too (the content)01:32
wolfsprauland we would have trouble getting to that level01:32
wolfspraulso high-res matters mostly for archival purposes01:32
wolfspraulmaybe screens in 10 years are 2000 dpi?01:32
wolfspraulwho knows :-)01:33
wpwrakit hasn't happened in the last 10 years :)01:33
wpwraknot that i'd complain about a nice 1000 dpi screen, far from it ...01:33
wolfspraulso I would always upload/archive the highest res I have01:33
wolfspraulI don't see an immediate print use though01:33
wolfspraulor even advertisement (say a big poster or so)01:34
wpwrak(archival) yeah, should put the originals somewhere outside my premises. good point.01:34
wpwrakfor the monthly news, are the scaled imaged sufficient or would you prefer to start over from less edited material ? or perhaps the .xcf, with full undo ?01:35
wolfspraulxcf?01:36
wolfspraulwhich images are you talking about now actually?01:36
wolfspraulif you have something in mind, please throw a URL into the news draft, or here in irc01:36
wpwrakone problem is how things look on the screen. i optimize them to look good on my screens, but i don't know how they look elsewhere01:36
wolfspraulMediawiki will do scaling01:36
wolfspraulso in Mediawiki, you can safely upload the highest resolution01:37
wpwrak.xcf = gimp's native format, with modification history01:37
wolfsprauloh01:37
wolfspraulusing that app for 10 years, never knew :-)01:37
wolfspraulbtw - did you see the discussions in KiCad about changed schematics format?01:37
wolfspraulscary stuff. of course talking is good, but some of the proposals are scary. I hope the outcome is good.01:37
wolfspraulwondering whether it will disrupt schhist01:37
wpwrak(kicad) ah no, haven't looked in a while01:38
wpwrakargh. seems that i got kicked off kicad-devel when openmoko.org was down :-(01:39
wpwrak-developers01:39
wpwrak(mediawiki) still waiting for a batch-able solution :) for now, the best workflow is to just upload to www-data@downloads.qi-hardware.com01:43
tuxbrainwolfspraul: (news) I think from my part the most important news are UBB are on stock and selling, the ArduNote project, and than Atben/Atusb production has started and will be aviable at mid/end May06:53
xiangfutuxbrain: I am just update some news on Community_news_2011-04-04 too :)06:54
wolfspraultuxbrain: ok, then please help me updating the page a little07:06
wolfspraulI'll do more too, of course.07:06
wolfspraulI doubt the news have a big impact, but we need to keep the routine and keep pushing for a wider audience...07:07
wolfspraulthanks for any help!07:07
wpwrakwolfspraul: you never know when someone comes looking :)07:26
tuxbrainOk I will try to complete the news this night07:27
rmhey all07:43
rmwhich video driver does the nanonote use while in X.org?07:43
rmis it fbdev or something better07:43
xiangfurm:  there is on X in nanonote.07:45
xiangfurm: nanonote using framebuffer directly07:45
wpwrakxiangfu: with jlime, there is :)07:45
xiangfurm: wpwrak oh. yes. jlime using X07:45
rmyep, I saw some videos with X on NN07:46
wpwrakhmm, xdpyinfo doesn't reveal much about the driver :-(07:49
wpwrakmay just be "dumb" frame buffer07:49
rmcheck /var/log/Xorg.0.log?07:54
rmI also saw it run Doom/Heretic/Hexen07:54
wpwrakrm: ls /var/log -> wtmp ;-)07:55
rmand at pretty impressive speeds07:55
rmso I wonder can this be with fbdev07:55
rmwpwrak, xvinfo07:55
wpwrakthe games are usually using sdl07:55
rmbut SDL still relies on accelerated drawing support provided by the xorg driver07:56
wpwraki think sdl just uses a dumb frame buffer and asks x to stay out of the way as much as possible07:57
wpwrakxvinfo: X-Video Extension version 2.2  screen #0  no adaptors present07:57
rmyou mean a canvas07:57
rmon which it draws by itself07:58
rmthat's almost right, but to draw on that dumb frame buffer / canvas, it still needs accelerated operations from X07:58
rmnot stuff like "draw line", "draw rectangle"07:59
rmbut rather "copy bitmap"07:59
wpwraki don't know enough about X to know how close to the hardware SDL can get. maybe it actually gets direct access to the frame buffer.07:59
wpwrakmemcpy ? :)07:59
rmI don't know much about X either07:59
wpwrak320x240x2 bytes isn't all that much to move around08:00
rmalso e.g. if the program wants to draw bitmaps in other format than what you have on screen08:00
wpwrakyes, that's usually when things suddenly get very very slow :)08:01
wpwraktuxbrain: ah, when the pcb fab sends the panelized gerbers, please also ask them for permission to publish them (cc-by-sa or such), so that we can fully document the process09:00
tuxbrainwpwrak: roger09:04
wpwraktuxbrain: have you already given them the "go ahead" ?09:05
wpwrakwolfspraul: potential entries for the 04-04: 1) the ben-wpan samples http://lists.en.qi-hardware.com/pipermail/discussion/2011-March/007457.html09:10
wpwrakwolfspraul: 2) the decision that tuxbrain will lead the production (and which may potentially have started already)09:12
wpwrakwolfspraul: 3) that we have a kernel that allows atben to communicate via ieee 802.15.409:13
wpwrakwolfspraul: not sure if 3) is newsworthy yet. there are still a few more things missing before it's actually useful09:14
wpwrakwolfspraul: regarding 2), there's also the integrated process for producing fab files, but i haven't documented it yet. at its core is ben-wpan/makefiles/Makefile.kicad, which is semi-generic09:16
lekernel"The attic concept may actually come in handy for a few other Qi projects and proposals"09:32
lekernellol09:32
wpwraklekernel: wolfgang's dungeon09:44
wolfspraulI shouldn't call the attic a 'concept', it's not that revolutionary. Just the attic, after all :-)10:21
qi-bot[commit] David Kühling: mplayer_jz47xx: package for experimental mplayer video acceleration driver http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/80a3d2d10:59
qi-bot[commit] David Kühling: add mplayer_jz47xx to config.full_system http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/3eb544811:57
zrafatuxbrain: is it possible to get or make in some future more sie boards? (sorry if the question is vague :) )12:44
zrafabtw, hello12:44
zrafato all12:44
wolfspraulhi12:47
zrafahey wolfspraul, hello12:47
zrafawolfspraul: maybe the question is for you as well :) (sie boards)12:49
wolfspraulof course it can be made12:49
wolfspraulit's copyleft :-)12:49
wolfspraulbut I am not planning a run, and many things that should be in motion for a run, imho, are not in motion12:49
wolfspraulSIE is in the attic :-)12:50
zrafawolfspraul: yes, but we would need of you to make that12:50
zrafawolfspraul: yes, I know12:50
wolfspraulof course we can dust it off and get it down from the attic again12:50
wolfsprauloh no, you definitely don't need 'me'12:50
zrafawolfspraul: YES12:50
zrafa:)12:50
wolfspraultuxbrain is proving with his fearless heart that anyone can do manufacturing, especially with high quality copyleft designs and processes12:51
zrafatuxbrain: yes, and I like that12:51
wolfspraulI am focused on milkymist one rc3 now, and want to do that really well12:51
wolfspraulI even let down Werner on ben-wpan, but tuxbrain jumped in and it's all great right now there12:51
wolfspraulI don't know yet what I will take on after rc3, rc3 actually has some sub-projects like another 200 jtag-serial boards, etc.12:52
wolfsprauleither rc4, or a mobile minimilky board along the lines of the former Xue, or - don't know yet :-)12:53
zrafawolfspraul: I am back at uni working, and of course, I was to check the status of sie projects there and I found some heart lives there working with that and better thinking on some nn or sie courses in the future. So I am helping12:53
wolfspraulthe technology is still there and good and has potential12:54
zrafawolfspraul: great that you want to do something well :) .. just kidding .. it is great for the milkymist project. I do not know much about, but I see a really open hardware project behind.12:55
wolfspraulthese things all connect together12:55
wolfspraulimo12:55
zrafawolfspraul: and for the ben-wpan project I hope tuxbrain and werner work until it is there.. At least I will buy and enjoy12:56
zrafawolfspraul: we (miriam and me) finally found a new apartment to rent on our new location. So we will rent next week. That gives me a place to have my desk properly set to work again ;)12:57
wolfspraulnice12:58
rjeffriesregarding another run od SIE aka swiss army knife card , similar to Ben + FPGA, are design changes required after that first runb of n=50 or so>15:27
wpwrakrjeffries: i think they found numerous small issues that should be corrected in a future run15:28
rjeffrieswpwrak. OK. I was noodling about whether deigning in the 4760 into an SIE V2 might be an interesting approach.15:29
rjeffriesuse SIE which does not have a pretty plastic enclosure to test the 476015:29
rjeffriesor, thinking out loud, is SIE considered to competitive with Milkylist? I don;t think it is, but just wondering15:30
kristianpaulYou dont need SIE after got a milkymist15:33
lars_well it is an alternative with a lower price16:01
lars_and it has a real cpu16:02
kristianpaullars_: indeed16:27
kristianpaullets wait for the xilinx chip with arm/logic blocks :-)16:27
kristianpaulprice lower +116:28
tuxbrainwolfspaul: (fearless heart) I love a lot the Killer RPG despcrition about characters like me they call them brave(and/or)stupids :P22:21
tuxbrainwpwrak:(wpan production) yes the ok was given, but then comes the weekend :), waiting for the specification of way of payment, maybe this time they allow me to do 30 days of grace instead of instant payment :) I'm starting to be a trusted company :P22:23
tuxbrainzrafa: I will not do sie my own, there is serios production issues last time and I have no notice than any body has resolved them, so for me is a no go right now.22:25
tuxbrainbuff is too late I finally arrive at home too late I'm really tired to start editing the wiki news now .... I know I said I will do but sorry :(, I hope I can do something tomorrow but is very unlikely....:(22:32
kristianpaultuxbrain: i dont bet wolfspaul or zrafa will read backlogs all the time..~22:35
kristianpaula minimmilkymist can beat a SIE board :-)22:37
kristianpaulminimilkymist*22:37
kristianpaulminimist*22:37
tuxbrainkristianpaul: pero mi conciencia se ha quedado tranquila (to late to try to translate the previous sentence)22:37
kristianpaultuxbrain: eso si :-)22:37
tuxbrainMMM(minimilkimist)22:37
kristianpaul:D22:37
tuxbrainNN MM and now MMM22:37
tuxbrainNNN (nasty NanoNote?)22:38
kristianpaulnext nano note22:38
kristianpaulxD22:39
tuxbrainyeah!22:39
tuxbrainYa=NNN22:39
Jay7nanonanonote22:40
kristianpauls/NNN/MMM22:40
Jay7time to have some sleep anyway22:41
kristianpaul:-)22:41
Action: kristianpaul is packing its mm1 and other stuff for the LabSurLab22:41
tuxbrainwolfspraul : If your read the backlogs I thing the more smart move for sharims to produce somthing is the Qi-phone22:41
Jay7and Qi-reader22:42
kristianpaulMMM can be a mother board for such us addons (GSM, reader, GPS-RF, Cam, ... )22:42
tuxbrainmmmm why not Qi-note, Qi-phone, Qi-reader, Qi-VJ. Qi-cam as qi-hardware product names?? I'm doing the Qi-wpan dongles :)22:43
kristianpaul:-)22:44
kristianpaulsure22:44
kristianpaulwell.. why not ;-)22:44
Jay7Qi-bug22:45
tuxbrainwe don't have bugs, we have futures enchancements :P22:45
Jay7BUG Labs produces some 'lego'22:45
kristianpaulyeah i think Jay7  mean that product22:45
Jay7;)22:45
kristianpaul"we don't have bugs" sure... ?22:46
kristianpaulah, yes22:46
Jay7well...22:47
Action: Jay7 is sleeping :)22:47
tuxbrainkristianpaul: in my case also are not called bugs once productions started, are called "reasons to kill wpwrak"22:48
tuxbrainJay7:  me too, gn822:48
kristianpaultuxbrain: (wprak ) hehe :-)22:49
kristianpaulnite22:49
wpwraktuxbrain: i'll check my perimeter defenses ;-)23:46
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