#qi-hardware IRC log for Friday, 2010-06-25

arctanxHas anyone seen the error "Unable to use mmc 0:1 for fatload ** Wrong Image Format for bootm command" trying to boot from SD? It looks remarkably similar to http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardFAQ#U-Boot_v1_unable_to_use_mmc_error though I'm not sure where the "mmcinit" command would be00:18
arctanxI'm using a u-boot built from a June 4 clone of openwrt-xburst00:19
freespacenot i00:54
arctanxAh, I seem to be deluded about where u-boot came from...02:35
arctanxD'oh. turns out the issue was I had an ext2 fs without a partition. Now it just isn't booting :) more funtimes ahead03:01
NecrosporusDoes NanoNote support usb0 network?07:43
emdeteNecrosporus: yes, client mode usb-ether07:49
kyakwhat do you mean "client mode"?07:50
NecrosporusHm... But anyway, I can't think out a use case07:50
emdetekyak: usb knows a master or host and clients on his bus07:50
emdetekyak: mouse, wlan adapter, kbd all are clients. your notebook is a host. the nn does not support host mode07:51
NecrosporusI can read with usual windows mobile pda, which I already have (but it need a new battery)07:51
NecrosporusI can listen the music as well07:51
kyakemdete: i see..07:51
NecrosporusI can type notes on my smartphone07:52
NecrosporusWhat is reason for that PDA?07:52
NecrosporusWhat I can do on NanoNote which I can't on my existing devices?07:52
freespacebuild your own from scratch07:53
freespacethough technically that's with the data07:53
emdeteNecrosporus: you may even take a pen & paper! heureka! :D07:53
Necrosporusfreespace, I don't have a microchip factory07:53
freespaceme neither07:53
rafatuxbrain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDoGNwM_zgg07:54
freespacenanonote isn't what i would call a consumer device07:54
NecrosporusSo... What's reason to buy a nano-note?07:54
freespaceit isn't "what can it do for me" but more "why can i do with it"07:54
freespacesame reason you get an arduino07:54
NecrosporusI can compile LFS on my Windows Mobile PDA as well07:54
NecrosporusI have installed Debian Lenny on it and it works07:55
freespaceyou get hardware and software, all of which is completely accessible, and you do whatever you want to it without any hinderance07:55
Necrosporusfreespace, what's hinderance about my Pocket Loox 710?07:55
NecrosporusIt can run Debian with haret07:56
bartbesmay I ask why you ask if you clearly have made your mind up?07:57
freespacei don't know, depends on what you want to do with it07:57
freespacedoes it happen to have a serial port?07:57
Necrosporus(pretty old PDA, but with 64 megs of RAM and 416MHz ARM)07:57
freespaceor some gpio pins?07:57
NecrosporusI have no idea... I don't have a flasher anyway07:58
freespaceflasher?07:58
NecrosporusSpecial device to reprogram ROM07:58
Necrosporus* EEPROM07:58
Necrosporusbartbes, because I don't know07:58
freespacewhat does that have to do with serial port of gpio pins?07:58
NecrosporusAFAIK, my pda support serial port07:59
NecrosporusBut I have to solder adapter by hand07:59
bartbesa reason nobody has mentioned: because of the community?07:59
NecrosporusI dunno what's gpio07:59
freespacegeneral purpose IO08:00
freespaceis the pocket loox 710 stil being made?08:00
NecrosporusProbably not08:00
NecrosporusIt's from 200408:00
NecrosporusWhen I was a windows user08:00
freespaceso despite the fact debian runs on it08:00
freespacei would say no one is developing just for it08:01
Necrosporusfreespace, not true08:02
NecrosporusI know a man who does08:02
freespacea single person08:02
freespace?08:02
NecrosporusHim modified Linux Kernel for me08:03
freespacethat's pretty cool08:03
freespacebut you can see that it is somewhat of a dead end08:03
freespacebecause the hardware is no longer being produced08:03
NecrosporusMaybe I'm even first person have worked with GNU/Linux on said PDA08:03
freespacethe number of ppl porting softwar for it will decline until it gets to zero08:03
freespacealong wih the number of working devices08:04
NecrosporusI can build LFS08:04
NecrosporusAnd port anything myself08:04
freespacebut you can't build another pocket loox 71008:04
freespaceif yours happen to break08:04
NecrosporusI can't build another NanoNote as well08:04
freespacethat is true08:04
NecrosporusI don't have a factory08:04
freespacehowever, some one else can build a nanonote08:04
NecrosporusI don't need another pl71008:05
urandom_wolfspraul ping08:05
NecrosporusIf this will break, I can just switch to other device08:05
freespaceand throw away all your porting effort08:05
freespaceand redo it again?08:05
bartbesurandom_: ping timeout (240 seconds)08:06
NecrosporusIt probably will be just effort for effort08:06
NecrosporusLike building LFS08:06
freespacewhat do you mean by "effort for effort"?08:06
NecrosporusI don't see, why I would like to get another pl710 if this will die08:07
NecrosporusI'd prefer a superior device instead08:07
NecrosporusI thought about buying a Samsung i5700 Spica... But as I know, it could be reflashed only frow windows08:08
wolfspraulurandom_: pong08:09
NecrosporusIt's only thing, why I decided not to buy it... plus maybe lack of money?08:09
NecrosporusNow I think about Highscreen Zeus08:09
NecrosporusIt can at least browse the internet08:10
NecrosporusNanoNote can't :(08:10
freespacesure it can08:10
NecrosporusHow?08:10
freespacei do it, just not in graphics mode, just yet08:10
freespaceusb networking08:10
NecrosporusWith usb cable?08:10
freespacenod08:10
freespacenot entirely ideal, but far from "can't browse the net"08:11
NecrosporusWhy I would do so if I can browse the internet from computer attached to other end?08:11
NecrosporusIt would be much more comfy, I suppose08:11
freespacei didn't say you shohuld08:11
freespacesimply that you can08:11
urandom_wolfspraul just wanted to ask if you would give bartbes a nanonote for free, i think you have already talked a bit to him, he is very skilled and has no rl so he can contribute lots of value to the project (and port ulove)08:11
Necrosporusfreespace, for me, I won't because it uncomfy ~= I can't08:12
freespacewon't != can't08:12
freespaceanyway, ok08:12
bartbesurandom_: wait, you just said I have no real life?08:12
freespaceit would seem the nanonote isn't suitable for you08:13
freespacewas there some particular reason you took an interest?08:13
urandom_bartbes well not as much as rude, just wanted to say you have lots of time for it :P08:13
NecrosporusOnly use for nanonote I can see is pocket bc08:14
NecrosporusBut I have a calculator already08:14
bartbesurandom_: btw, he's in #loveclub as well08:14
bartbesjust saying08:15
urandom_oh did not see08:15
bartbesbut the others just stopped talking so..08:15
freespaceit would appear then you have no use for a nanonote08:15
arctanxwolfspraul: I have a quick question if you have a minute... when you were testing various SD cards with the NN, what was your way of telling if they're not working? Could they not be read at all or was there difficulty booting from them?08:15
Necrosporusfreespace, book reader08:16
wolfspraulurandom_: we (me) cannot give away units for free, because I already subsidize every device with both cash and time :-)08:16
freespaceok, odd choice given how small a screen it has, and not even eink08:16
wolfspraulso each time I 'sell' (ahem) one I give cash with it08:16
NecrosporusMy pocket loox battery is broken08:17
NecrosporusBut it was a pretty good reader08:17
wolfspraulbut sometimes we find other people who donate devices, or rather pay for a device to be donated to someone08:17
NecrosporusIt can work from battery only for less than hour08:17
wolfspraulhe is in Germany?08:17
urandom_netherlands he is08:17
wolfspraulah OK08:18
freespacesurely there are other devices at a similar price point that will do the job?08:18
NecrosporusI don't know...08:18
neil_Necrosporus: the NanoNote does have an advantage here then: it takes standard Nokia batteries so you would't be stuck without a replacement battery ever again08:18
freespacethat said, it should act as a reader fine08:18
wolfspraulurandom_: quickest solution is we need to find someone to cough up 99 EUR08:19
freespaceit's other shortcomings dosn't distract from that08:19
freespace*detract08:19
Necrosporusneil_, hm... is there only one sort of nokia battery?08:19
wolfspraularctanx: 'testing' I just try to boot, nothing more08:19
neil_Necrosporus: probably many, but BL-4C and BL-5C are very popular08:20
neil_Necrosporus: and still being produced08:20
urandom_wolfspraul i know you guys dont have much money but giving bartbes one yould increase the sales a lot in the long run maybe so would be an investment08:20
urandom_also i cant donate one for bartbes myself cause i earn no money08:21
arctanxwolfspraul: Cool. Do you know how u-boot fails when it's an unsupported kind of card? e.g., I currently have only a single card and it's reading /boot/uImage then freezing. It would be useful to me to know if that's an unsupported-card type of failure or something else entirely08:22
freespacesuppose if you make a convincing case, you can get a enough ppl to each donate enough to get him one08:22
wolfspraularctanx: probably the u-boot bug. xiangfu is on it, ping him.08:22
arctanxwolfspraul: oh okay, I obviously haven't been following closely enough, thanks for hte tip08:22
wolfspraulurandom_: the success of this project depends on our ability to find more people to share in, cash and time-wise08:23
wolfspraulmore shoulders08:23
wolfspraulso any logic like "can't you just add another 99 EUR after you already chipped in 150k EUR" won't work with me08:23
wolfspraulif we don't find more people to share costs, the project will fail08:24
wolfspraulwhether I ship out free Nanos or not (I have never done that and won't)08:24
freespaceurandom_: see my earlier comment. make a convincing case and perhaps some of us here will donate enough to get him one08:24
wolfspraulwe will have the same situation with Milkymist One very soon08:24
wolfspraulso far we have been quite successful at building a real community, with good hacking going on, good seeds08:24
urandom_who has paid for wejps nano?08:24
bartbesseeing this makes me feel guilty.. :(08:25
wolfspraulwe had some where multiple people shared the costs08:25
wolfspraulbartbes: no! it's good! :-)08:26
wolfspraulwe need to become more open minded in helping each other08:26
wolfspraulthat is true for all parties08:26
freespacedepending on what bartbes will bring, i am not against donating towards getting him a nanonote08:26
urandom_freespace porting ulove should be convincing enough08:26
freespacewhat's ulove?08:27
wolfspraulthe only thing is that I really think for me personally I am already maxing it out, so just because I have a warehouse in Hong Kong with 2xx Nanos in it doesn't mean I can press the magic button and ship free devices out08:27
wolfspraulif I would do that I would kill the project08:27
wolfspraululove is cool08:27
freespacegoogle isnt much help on what it is :)08:27
wolfspraula game engine using Lua and SDL08:27
freespaceah08:27
wolfspraulwhat is the hp again? loeveproject.org?08:28
urandom_love2d.org08:28
wolfspraulah08:28
wolfspraulbartbes: basically when you step forward and could do so many good things but can't just throw 99 EUR at it, it's a good opportunity for our project to make it more clear that we are a community funded project08:30
wolfspraulthat people can help each other, donate or loan gear to each other, etc.08:30
wolfspraulif we don't take the time to communicate this, everybody will just think there is this big company somewhere throwing out free devices ala Google or Intel08:31
bartbesthat would be cool though :P08:31
wolfspraulbut there isn't, and we need to take the time to communicate this for the long term success of our project08:31
wolfspraulnot necessarily08:31
arctanxwolfspraul: are you serious about the $150k? I'd be scared as hell08:31
wolfspraulI have seen such companies giving away tons of gear without any measurable results.08:31
wolfspraulwhat a waste08:32
wolfspraulsure I'm serious08:32
bartbestrue, wasting is bad08:32
bartbesand 150k is bad as well..08:32
arctanxstrewth08:32
wolfspraulno I'm not scared, all fine. project is a lot of fun! I actually trust this free software stuff and community :-)08:32
bartbesyou are dedicated...08:32
arctanxawesome :)08:32
wolfspraullook what we've achieved already08:32
wolfspraulthanks to endless people who contribute, without pay08:32
wolfspraulwe are building a whole little free distro08:33
wolfspraulmultiple even with JLiMe08:33
wolfspraulI like this much better than Android or Ubuntu or MeeGo08:33
urandom_yeah08:33
arctanxat linux.conf.au 2008 they gave away about 400 OLPC laptops08:36
wolfspraulI bet.08:36
arctanxI'm sure there was some excellent work done as a result08:36
arctanxbut by and large I doubt it was a nett win08:36
arctanxI agree that it's not a good strategy08:37
urandom_well 400 is lot of stuff but i gues you have to give some devices to core devs to be succesfull08:38
wolfspraulno08:39
wolfspraultotally disagree08:39
wolfspraulI have lots of first-hand experience in this.08:39
wolfspraulwhat works is very very subtle08:39
wolfspraulsuccess most often depends on very few, even one, key individuals08:39
freespacegive away enough laptops and you will get some excellent work. the question is whether there was net gain.08:39
wolfspraullike Lars in our case08:40
arctanxfreespace: right, and I haven't heard anything to suggest there was08:40
arctanxheck, the OLPCs have run windows for a while now08:40
wolfspraulno giving away in this style is just clueless, will devalue their product, most devices will end in the drawer, etc.08:40
freespaceiirc, not all of them were given to devs08:40
freespacesome of them were given to sick children08:40
wolfspraulat least for me I can say I believe in individuals08:41
bartbeswell, at least that's the purpose of the project08:41
wolfspraulI do believe that bartbes could make a different wrt loeve on NanoNote08:41
wolfspraulso I'm very interested in him having one08:41
wolfspraulbut then - how to solve the finance problem? that's a good second challenge.08:41
urandom_dont we have any damaged nano that are good enough for development but cant be sold to enduser?08:44
freespaceexcellent idea urandom_08:45
wolfspraulyeah I was thinking about that too08:45
freespacealso maybe something like http://nextsprocket.com/08:45
wolfspraulbut hardware quality of NanoNote is extremely good. Adam may have one or two damaged ones soon.08:45
wolfspraulif he can repair them we would probably not sell08:45
wolfspraulI will try to see what is there, I definitely try to not leave even one piece of any sample or prototype lying around somewhere.08:46
rafawolfspraul: your work is great man, and I really like how well you do it.. I would like to see several wolfgans around showing the product in conferences, magazines, little meetings, whatever. I feel that many people do not understand well the Qi goals... But on the other hand people without business/talk/open hardware skills like me do not find an easy way to help with the success of the project.08:55
bartbesrafa: he just left..08:58
rafaI think that if every guy buying a nn is happy with it, then a nice way to help is to convice, at least, another person to get one. Because if you have a friend with a nn as well you would find more enthusiasm to work in it.. because you and your friend will have two machines, so would share experiences and stuff.08:58
rafabartbes: no matter.. it is just the current talk08:58
rafaI like how zear was happy with his nn and hard was to work with it at the beggining.. so I really wanted to get one08:59
rafaand how hard*08:59
urandom_wolfspraul is reading irc archives anyway (or at least sometimes he is)08:59
rafaso we would be two08:59
arctanxI'll certainly try to show off my NN as much as possible at LCA201109:00
arctanxI'm sure there'll be quite a bit of interest09:01
freespacei meant to show it off at pyconau, but turns out they sold out09:01
arctanxoh you're in sydney for that are you?09:01
freespacenah, i am in sydney09:01
freespaceregardless of pycon :P09:01
arctanxOh, cool, I'm in Hobart09:01
freespaceah, cool :)09:02
arctanxwe'll have to make an NN posse or possibly do a miniconf talk in jan09:02
freespacewhere is lca 2011?09:02
arctanxbrisbane09:02
freespacehrm, not bad09:02
rafafreespace: arctanx: perhaps you can show jlime as well? : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDoGNwM_zgg  :)09:03
freespacesure :)09:04
arctanxrafa: that's awesome, I should give it a go once I manage to get SD boot working09:04
rafaarctanx: jlime always works on sd.. it is not hard.09:05
freespacei need a) less pilots running b) less business documents to write c) more caffine09:05
arctanxrafa: I'm having trouble even getting u-boot to run my kernel, but I'll definitely check it out09:05
rafaarctanx: if you use the bootloader, kernel, and rootfs from jlime.com you will not have problems to boot jlime09:06
arctanxrafa: okay I'll give it a go sometime soon09:06
rafaarctanx: freespace : I will upload that current rootfs today (the video rootfs)09:06
arctanxwhat I should do is come up with an entertaining 3-minute lightning talk with the nanonote as the topic09:07
arctanxthose are run in front of the entire audience at the end of LCA09:07
arctanxand I have a little experience writing that kind of talk too09:07
freespacedoes jlime have a graphical browser rafa?09:09
rafafreespace: which kind of browser?09:11
rafaweb browser?09:11
freespaceyeah, sorry to be unspecific09:11
rafafreespace: several.. it is based in OE, so the repo should have several of them. What we were happy always with the years, in hp jornadas, is using dillo09:12
rafaand we would add dillo to main rootfs soon surely09:12
freespacethat's pretty awesome :D09:13
freespacelet me liberate a SD card :)09:14
rafafreespace: but whatever distro you use, you can try links, links2, w3m, lynx, konkeror gtk109:14
freespacei would ideally like gfx support09:15
freespaceand managed to links2 running in graphics mode on openwrt09:15
freespacebut it's laggy, runs out of memory quickly, and is has graphic bugs09:15
freespaceneeds swap if nothing else09:15
rafann should have always swap..09:16
rafaevery linux around should have swap09:16
rafastill if you have 16GB of ram and use icewm09:16
freespacei was looking at netsurf next09:16
freespacemaybe i forgot something when building my image09:17
freespacebut i have no swap :P09:17
freespacehaven't got around to fixing it09:17
freespacebeen keeping strange hours due to working with ppl in the states09:18
tuxbrain-hi channel from a sunny beach ;)13:40
bartbeshi man on a sunny beach13:41
tuxbrain-anything new in this two days (question mark)13:41
bartbesthat's a short question mark!13:42
bartbesbut I couldn't really tell, I've mostly been lurking13:42
tuxbrain-this silly mobile doesn't allow to use some marks when on chat (sigh) ok bartbes just asking too many hours without been hanged here see you later maybe13:48
bartbesmaybe a hot girl showed up at the beach...13:48
heowAnybody get a card stuck in the sd slot?   Mine won't come out and I'm debating if I should disassemble it to get it out.14:42
zeari think i got it once14:42
zearbut i pressed it a couple of times and it went out by itself14:42
nebajoththat's what she said14:43
heowHmm.   Mine presses in, but won't come out anymore.  Nor is grabbing it with tiny pliers work.14:43
nebajoth^14:43
bartbespickaxe?14:43
bartbesin my experience all sd slots can be annoying14:44
bartbesmostly those that do not have the sd card sticking out14:44
heowOh well, it's now a perma-card, the stuck sd is stopping the board from being pried up.14:54
bartbesyou know you're going to spend every minute of your life trying to get the card out14:56
bartbeslike everytime you use it you're going to try pressing the sd card14:57
bartbesfirst because you have hope14:57
bartbesthen because it became a habit14:57
heowI'll develop an sd-card sized twitch which I'll carry to my deathbed.15:00
kyakwe really need to get rid of this "TV LCD" in Ya15:16
kyakit just renders fonts less then 10 pt unusable15:17
kyaki'm comparing with my 320x240 Nokia N73 LCD screen15:17
kyakputty for symbian is displaying 5x7 fonts just AWESOME15:18
kyakall because of straight dot lines, as i believe15:18
kyakby the way, here's a little progress with utf-8 in Ben's console: http://downloads.qi-hardware.com/people/kyak/tmp/utf-8.png15:33
kyakhttp://downloads.qi-hardware.com/people/kyak/tmp/utf-8_photo.jpg15:33
heowWow, that's really cool.15:36
sdschulzekyak: OpenWRT?16:11
kyakyep16:11
ezdagorAnyone know ho to get audio working under Debian?16:34
sdschulzeezdagor: me :)16:40
sdschulzeI compiled my own kernel.16:41
sdschulzehttp://sdschulze.dnsalias.org/~soeren/content/debian-nanonote-kernel.txt16:41
sdschulzeBut be warned: you won't be able to play any compressed audio files.16:41
sdschulzeMPlayer uses floating-point by default, but the NanoNote doesn't have an FPU.16:42
sdschulzelekernel: hi -- you the MilkyMist guy?16:48
calamarzsdschulze: do you have at some place public the .config you used for compiling the kernel?16:49
calamarzlast weekend I was trying to emulate your steps but got no luck :(16:49
sdschulzeI should be able to find it.16:50
sdschulzeWhat didn't work?16:50
calamarzkernel was not booting :p16:50
sdschulzeoh16:51
lekernelsdschulze, hi, yes16:51
sdschulzehttp://sdschulze.dnsalias.org/~soeren/content/nn-kconfig16:53
calamarzalso, I tried to compile some kernel modules with the openwrt toolchain to put them on my debian /lib/modules, but I was not even getting the ipkgs... think I screwed it up at some point16:53
sdschulzecalamarz: would be kind if you could diff it to your .config16:53
sdschulzecalamarz: The ones I tried were not binary-compatible.16:54
sdschulze(I hope I got the right file.)16:54
calamarzsdschulze: thanks man... still at job, but I'll keep trying this loong weekend :)16:56
sdschulzelekernel: So there are plans to turn MilkyMist into a general-purpose CPU?16:57
lekernelnot by myself but it can be done16:58
lekernelanyway it already contains a general purpose CPU that beats the proprietary Microblaze alternative by a 15-35% increase in speed16:59
sdschulzeCould it be even more boosted when implemented in an ASIC?17:02
sdschulzedue to the higher clock speed17:02
lekernelyes17:03
lekernelshould run at ~8x the speed of the FPGA in 90nm for example17:03
lekernelmaybe more17:04
sdschulzelekernel: How complete is the free software toolchain for that kind of development, BTW?17:08
lekernelgcc is getting ok (people start to fix the ICEs)17:09
lekernelit's supported in 4.5+17:09
lekernelthe linux port isn't so good, lots of bugs, lots of dirty code and hacks, etc.17:09
lekernelthat's why I won't use it and put RTEMS instead17:09
lekernelbut if you want to fix Linux problems you're welcome17:10
sdschulzeOh, I meant things like the synthesizer, the FPGA programmer, etc.17:11
lekernelthere are good simulators17:12
lekernel(open source)17:12
sdschulzeWhich one are you using?17:13
lekernelthere are some JTAG programming tools of various qualities (usually mediocre, but the proprietary tool sucks too)17:13
lekerneland for synthesis open source solutions are totally non-existent17:13
lekernelgplcver mostly17:14
sdschulzeIs it better than Ikarus?17:15
lekernelabout the same17:15
sdschulze*Icarus17:15
lekernelthough it has fewer bugs it seems17:15
lekernelbut I haven't tested the latest icarus versions17:15
sdschulzeLatest?  Development is going on again? :)17:16
sdschulzeHm, is synthesis such a dark magic?17:17
emebsynthesis is dark magic17:20
lekernelno, but developers are slackasses17:20
emebconsidering how much the synthesis tools companies charge for it anyway...17:20
lekernelemeb, that's not a good metric17:21
Action: emeb has used both gplcver and icarus verilog. Both are good.17:21
sdschulzeThereby, they only *suggest* that it's hard.17:21
emebicarus is pretty durn good these days - can simulate large Xilinx designs fast & with equivalent results to modelsim17:22
lekernelwell, sure, it's harder than writing an arduino flasher17:22
sdschulzelekernel: :)17:22
lekernelbut at least the LLVM project has the same level technical level as a synthesizer (imho)17:23
emebtheoretically icarus can synthesize but I've never tried it.17:23
lekernelicarus synthesis is crap, you can't do anything with it17:23
lekernelnot even the simplest led blinker17:23
Action: sdschulze still doesn't understand the purpose of Arduino.17:23
emebembedded computing for the masses.17:23
sdschulzeemeb: Why not just take an AVR directly?17:24
emebwell sure - there you go asking hard questions.17:24
emebbeats me -17:24
emebcorrect me, but isn't the Ard programming environment just a wrapper around gcc?17:25
lekernelarduino is about the community, technically there's almost nothing17:25
lekernelit's a gcc wrapper indeed17:26
emebinstead of writing 'main.c' you write stubs that they pull together with their code & libs.17:26
lekernelyes17:26
emebbut it's still just c17:26
emebkeeps the newbs from having to deal with crt.s etc17:26
sdschulzeUse avr-libc.17:27
lekernelsdschulze, this assumes they know how to use a linker17:27
lekernelsame with board and soldering iron17:27
emebI wouldn't use it, but I thing it's a great way to get folks going w/o too much hassle.17:28
lekernelplus the bootloader is pre-flashed, so they don't even have to use an ISP download cable17:28
emebdownside of that is they can't buy vanilla AVRs - they have to get 'em pre-flashed w/ bootloader.17:29
emebmarket opportunity for folks like Sparkfun selling flashed AVRs to the ARD set.17:29
lekernelwell, that's a bargain17:30
lekernelthe biggest downside (imo) is the amount of buzz and quackery surrounding it17:30
sdschulzelekernel: So MilkyMist started as an academic project of yours?17:30
lekernelno, it started before I was at university, and then I had to write a thesis on something17:32
sdschulzeah, nice17:33
Action: sdschulze is currently 3 months before university.17:34
lekernelI had the idea of the project in may 2007 actually17:34
lekernelback then I hadn't touched an fpga :)17:34
sdschulzewhat kind of thesis?  Bachelor/Master/PhD?17:35
lekernelmaster17:35
lekernelnow I'm done with studies :)17:37
sdschulzeMy intention is that I'm interested in making CPUs more friendly towards high-level programming languages with all their sanity checks and polymorphism.17:38
sdschulzeI hope I will be able to grap up something like that as an academic project, too.17:43
mthlarsc: did you see this commit? http://github.com/mthuurne/opendingux-kernel/commit/bf7a28bf0d34c3796df7d0547947ba43705560a519:22
larscyes19:39
larscit's a bit strange that things actually worked with that bug present19:40
nebajothisn't pretty much everything dependent on the system clock?19:48
mthlarsc: it didn't work when the bug was present, for example debugfs showed a bogus value20:02
mthbut most child clocks call jz_clk_pll_get_rate directly instead of through the struct20:02
kristianpaul!seen wolfspraul20:15
kristianpaulseen wolfspraul20:15
kristianpaulhmm20:15
arctanxrafa: I had a go at that using that u-boot you linked on the mailing list but I'm still getting screen corruption & failed boot from SD. my understanding from discussing it in here yesterday is that there's an ongoing known bug22:04
arctanxthat was with the debian stuff, I'm yet to try it with full jlime kernel & root22:04
arctanxthat's probably a really good troubleshooting idea actually22:05
rafaarctanx: have you erased the complete NAND before to reflash the uboot?22:13
rafayou could not imagine how strange it is when you do not erase the complete nand before to reflash22:14
arctanxrafa: oddly enough, for the first time I skipped that step, because it's a pain22:15
arctanxI'm currently trying to set up a jlime installation so I'll come back to it in a bit22:16
arctanxthanks for the heads up22:16
rafaarctanx: but, okey, the problem is u-boot and you need to fix it first22:16
rafait is not something in sd22:16
rafaplease, usbboot your nn and erase the whole nand, then install the u-boot again22:16
arctanxYeah I'm going to do it anyway for this jlime installation, so I'll make sure I do the erase22:17
rafaarctanx: great, I will try to upload the new rootfs soon so we will have more fun ;)22:17
rafa(I am having a little problem with the auto make rootfs now..)22:17
arctanxokay22:17
arctanxahaha woo the jlime lives22:23
Overdrivehi ppl, I was interested in Ben Nanonote, however i think screen is too small to me. I would like to ask (as maybe you know) if there are any alternatives of laptops from 7" to 14" with completely free hardware like Ben Nanonote22:27
mthOverdrive: some Eee models are sold with Linux, but I don't know whether they use binary drivers or firmware22:32
Overdriveyep, I was thinking in all hw components as well22:32
Overdrivebut I would like one to develop, and develop in 3" is too small to me :_(22:33
urandom__there isnt much really free hardware yet22:34
Overdrivei think Ben Nanonote is a good idea, but i think it will have more success with a 9 or 10" on the screen22:36
urandom__nah an 10" wouldnt fit in my pockets22:36
mthdifferent size devices are good for different tasks22:37
urandom__the nice thing about it is that it is ultra portable, more like a small mobile phone than an laptop22:38
urandom__and yeah i had some ideas about a 7" nano myself ^^22:38
Overdrivehm Nanonote includes wireless card? or should you connect via usb?22:40
urandom__usb22:40
Overdrivean external one? :-)22:40
urandom__there is a microsd wireless card but not very cheap22:40
Overdrivehm, so at the moment my only alternative is a asus eeepc :/22:41
Overdrivebut stills non-free hw22:41
mthmake sure you avoid the Intel Poulsbo (GMA500) chipset, it seems to be very poorly supported22:42
mthunlike other Intel chipsets, which are very well supported22:42
mthapparently this is something they licensed from another company without thinking of how they're going to do Linux support for it22:42
urandom__there are some nice mips based netbooks, they are a bit more "free"22:42
urandom__Overdrive the best would be you would buy an ben nanonote to support the free hardware movement so that one day an bigger nano can be produced :P22:45
Overdriveurandom__: well, i support the fsf directly sending some money :-p but i'm 'poor' so i cannot spent more money22:46
urandom__Overdrive http://www.lemote.com/en/products/Notebook/2010/0310/112.html but dont know it is any good22:47
Overdrivethanks urandom__ looks closer to my requirements22:50
arclimewell this is pretty nifty23:11
arclimefbterm++23:12
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