#homecmos IRC log for Friday, 2012-05-11

--- Fri May 11 201200:00
B0101hello azonenberg07:53
azonenbergjo07:53
B0101its believed that in 10 years time, moores law will no longer be scalable to build new systems07:54
B0101do you agree?07:55
azonenbergI havent kept on top of the physics08:15
azonenbergbut densities wont be able to increase forever in 2D08:15
azonenbergonce you get to single-atom dimensions thats it08:15
azonenbergat that point the only way to go is up08:15
B01013d chips?08:24
azonenbergYep08:24
B0101then what? Bio computing? Quantum Computing?08:25
azonenbergNo idea08:25
azonenbergbut i do know that there's a lot of untapped potential in 3d08:25
azonenbergif people can figure out how to cool them at least08:25
azonenbergBut you know what's going to have to happen eventually?08:25
azonenbergPeople will realize that javascript is not the future08:26
azonenbergThat wasting resources and hoping the next-generation computers will be able to run your code08:26
azonenbergIs a bad idea08:26
azonenbergBecause one day, they won't be able to08:26
B0101but then... most of our websites are run using Javascript08:27
azonenbergMaybe people will realize one day that active content isnt the greatest idea08:27
azonenbergand that stuff can be made much more lightweight and efficient08:27
azonenbergwith less frills08:27
B0101ah, but if they do not realize it, then we have to wait for the collapse of the internet08:29
azonenbergWell, one day we will have Web 4.008:30
azonenbergall text and content08:30
azonenbergminimal fuss, no clientside plugins or scripting08:30
azonenbergjust data08:30
azonenbergno flashy nonsense, no videos, no banner ads08:30
B0101for some reason, some sites won't allow you to type alphanumeric passwords with symbols08:34
azonenbergIncredibly annoying08:34
azonenbergi use symbols in my passwords all the time08:34
azonenbergbecause a lot of people don't guess them08:34
azonenbergso in addition to increasing entropy against a dedicated bruteforce, you might be *impossible* for someome to break using a casual search that only does alphanumeric08:35
B0101its more annoying when the site in question is a network remote administration site08:36
B0101but then, i don't feel safe using a network administration site outside my network08:37
B0101and some admins still use easy to break algorithms to "secure" their networks08:41
B0101one example is WEP08:42
azonenbergLol08:42
azonenbergWeak Encryption Protocol08:42
azonenberg:p08:42
azonenbergor Worthless, your choice08:42
azonenbergThe only remote administration i trust is a VPN using certificate based (no passwords) authentication08:43
azonenberg4096 bit RSA + AES-256 is enough to keep most hackers out i think08:43
azonenbergthen SSH inside that to the specific host of interest, also certificate based auth only08:43
B0101that should be safe, but really though, the only safe machine is the machine that is never turned on08:44
azonenbergAirgapping is pretty good too08:44
azonenbergthe world's most effective firewall08:44
azonenbergan inch of air between the NIC and the cable08:44
azonenbergat that point your only holes are shared media and physical access08:45
B0101ah08:47
soul-dwich still is a problem since half of the  "hackers" are disgruntled  employees08:53
azonenbergsoul-d: True, but it's pretty good at keeping the other half out08:53
azonenbergWhich is a start08:53
azonenbergTo catch insiders you need good auditing08:53
soul-dother then that i can only hope ure right08:54
azonenbergideally using methods like streaming syslog to an offsite server only the most senior people08:54
azonenberghave access to08:54
azonenbergso you can break in but will hopefully leave tracks in the process08:54
azonenbergthat you cant later remove08:54
soul-dwebroswer these day's  need to much resources  like  1 gb ~ mem08:54
azonenbergsoul-d: lol, yes08:54
azonenbergIts ridiculous08:54
azonenbergThe laptop i'm building is going to be super simple and probably use like 32KB of ram per page or somethign like that08:55
azonenbergnot counting graphics08:55
azonenbergi have some interesting ideas to get good performance without using tons of memory or cpu08:55
azonenbergas a minimum, pages should be "frozen" when not active08:55
azonenbergand not use any CPU if they arent actually being displayed08:55
azonenbergjust dont send any events08:55
B0101then what about the operating system?08:56
azonenbergI'm expecting the OS will start up in about 1500ms08:57
azonenbergusing maybe a megabyte or two of ram08:57
azonenbergi have some pretty radical ideas on how to do a no-frills design08:57
azonenbergthey arent flashy enough to make money from the masses (android and iOS, i'm looking at you) but i'm pretty sure i can get them to work08:57
B0101hmm, i saw like a web browser for MS-DOS. don't remember its name but its quite fast for a GUI DOS browser08:59
azonenbergYeah, thats the type of thing i'm looking for09:00
azonenbergbare bones, support most HTML and CSS09:00
azonenbergbut no scripting09:00
azonenbergno flash09:00
azonenbergno video, no animated gifs09:00
soul-donly knoq lynx for linux09:00
azonenbergsoul-d: dillo is the next step up from lynx09:00
azonenbergbut doesnt support CSS properly09:00
azonenbergwhich makes it unusable for most modern sites09:00
azonenbergif it did. it'd be my main browser09:01
soul-dtrue never gotten used to it  but liked the idea   and windows stay responsive   i realy hate when  comp is  locked up  or gets unresponsive  cause of  a flash  thing09:04
azonenbergYeah09:04
azonenbergThats why my goal is basically to reinvent computing based on minimalism09:04
azonenbergmore secure since you have less code09:04
azonenbergand less code = less bugs09:05
azonenbergfaster, more reliable09:05
azonenbergless bloat09:05
B0101bloat though is what makes microsoft and apple rich09:06
soul-dwould like to see system where  the input is sperated from  the actual procceses  so that there alway's is some control  if the computing area is  locked or slow09:06
azonenbergB0101: exactly09:06
azonenbergnobody will get rich off an operating system that doesnt have sexy new features every release09:06
azonenbergbut i dont want to get rich09:06
azonenbergi want an OS that gets its job done09:07
azonenbergand fades into the background so i can pretend its not there09:07
soul-di installed  windows 7  with  some trouble  did liked it for a bit until the weird stuff happens09:07
azonenbergwell in a few years, by the end of my phd, i should have some pretty nice stuff lol09:07
B0101sad to think that they are trying to phase out multi boot from the new motherboards though09:07
soul-dif your goals is money you won't  find the motivation to do it anyhow09:07
azonenbergwhat do you mean, phase out multiboot?09:08
azonenbergand i've given up on stock hardware a while ago09:08
azonenbergHence why i'm building my own09:08
azonenbergfrom scratch09:08
B0101own motherboards?09:08
azonenbergyeah09:08
B0101that will be easy to program (you know the hardware)09:09
soul-di think  he means the thing where microsoft  wanted some bios fueture  to lockout linux or   not signed  osses ?09:09
azonenbergMandating signed code is *good* from a security perspective09:09
azonenbergiff09:09
azonenbergthe owner can add new root CAs09:09
azonenbergand remove existing ones09:09
azonenbergBeacuse it means i can untrust m$ and trust Debian, for example09:10
azonenbergor only trust code i've compiled myself09:10
soul-dyeah but i geuss only  microsoft wanted to dictated what gets added :)09:10
azonenbergYes09:10
azonenbergand that is a problem09:10
azonenbergBut like i said i've given up on stock hardware09:11
azonenbergi'm building for reliability and stability09:11
soul-dwas looking at new gfxcard09:11
soul-dcrazy prices09:11
azonenbergnot maximum speed for a few days, then break :p09:11
azonenbergMy stuff will likely cost more than stock, no bulk discount09:11
azonenbergbut it'll get the job done09:11
azonenbergfirst step is to cut out x8609:11
azonenbergmy prototype platform is mips, i may use arm at some point too09:12
B0101what are you going to use for the northbridge and southbridge?09:13
azonenbergI won't be having either, per se09:13
azonenbergon-chip memory controller in the current prototype09:13
azonenbergits more of a SoC design09:13
azonenbergmy FPGA version has an 80 MHz MIPS-1 running on it now and i will likely move to the Zynq Z-7000 series at some point09:14
azonenbergwhich has an 800 MHz dual core cortex a909:14
azonenbergand an FPGA09:14
azonenbergcombine that with an open source gpu on the fpga, no binary blob drivers needed09:14
azonenberga gig or so of DDR309:14
B0101ah09:15
azonenberglike i said i'm planning to go for extreme simplicity09:15
soul-danother advantage is  that hackers  are unlikly to target your  system09:15
azonenbergThats only as long as i'm off the radar09:16
azonenbergif it gains traction it will become a target09:16
azonenberghowever the simpler it is, the less code there is to find bugs in09:16
azonenberglike i said give me a few years09:16
azonenbergi'm kind of writing a phd thesis on this09:16
B0101well, less publicity = less crackers09:16
azonenbergso i dont have all the answers yet09:16
soul-dbut internet will change sooner or later  some crapy webpage  these day's wants money if you  block there crapy  ad scripts09:24
azonenbergsoul-d: all that means09:24
azonenbergis that you need to find a way to block them more subtly09:24
azonenbergi've never met an ad i couldnt beat09:24
soul-dih they get blocked still but sites noticed it and pops up a msg   saying they want you to pay montly  if you want to read  the site09:25
soul-d basicly  digging it's own  end09:25
azonenbergyeah09:25
azonenbergthe more intrusive it is, the more effort i'm willing to spend on defeating it09:25
soul-dindeed09:25
soul-dor stuff like spoiler tags  only readable if your member of  forum :')09:26
azonenbergwell stuff that needs server side logins is a bit more of a pain09:27
soul-doh it's a "public" forum  ( not realy that intresting except  like  going to local slumps  for kicks  see what all the weird people are ranting about today ? )09:28
soul-dsorta  a news site   but  pretty much  back to old day's since they buy  the news from official news feeds  and rewrite them :)09:30
Action: B0101 does not understand why some people can drive backwards at high speed... o_O09:30
azonenbergAre they driving forwards at the same time?09:30
azonenbergDifferential drivers do exist, you know ;)09:31
soul-did prolbably  have  trouble  going forward correctly :P09:33
azonenbergi sometimes jokingly wonder if the bus service at my school would be faster09:34
azonenbergif they hired differential drivers09:34
azonenbergDifferential buses can run safely at higher speeds, right? ;)09:34
Action: B0101 recovers from brain crash while thinking about vehicles with 2 steering wheels...09:39
azonenberglol09:39
soul-dlast coffee see if i can get brain started off for then day09:44
soul-dshould realy block news sites lol  only  make you depressive09:48
azonenbergLol09:49
soul-dmaybe keep it to news like " http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/ "  much less irritation there09:55
B0101lol09:56
azonenberg<!-- if the lhc actually destroys the earth & this page isn't yet updated please email mike@frantic.org to receive a full refund -->10:13
soul-dheh10:19
--- Sat May 12 201200:00

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