#homecmos IRC log for Friday, 2011-10-07

flyback-I really hope you guys give long lectures daily on the dangers of HF03:08
flyback-so people are careful out there :P03:08
azonenbergI actually have not been using HF in any of my recent work03:08
flyback-what do you use03:08
azonenbergThoguh its there as i do need it sometimes03:08
azonenbergconcentration? 3%03:09
flyback-that is HF03:09
azonenbergBut i have not needed to etch SiO2 or Ta2O5 recently03:09
azonenberghence why i havent used it03:09
azonenbergand i'm fully aware its hf http://www.whink.com/cmssites/ws0811www.whink.com/uploads/Documents/MSDS/Moonglum/Rust%20%20Stain%20Remover%2010062008.pdf03:09
flyback-they put Denatonium Benzoate03:10
flyback-just why03:11
flyback-by the time it's in your mouth, your teeth etc are fucked anyways03:11
azonenberglol, i was wondering the same myself03:11
flyback-i'm surprised the stuff is safe enough for laundry but yet still eats silicon03:11
azonenbergflyback-: laundry?03:12
azonenbergits for toilet cleaning afaik03:12
azonenbergand it doesnt eat Si, it eats SiO203:12
azonenbergI think the idea is, stubborn rust stain on sink/toilet03:12
azonenbergdissolve top micron or so of glaze on the porcelain03:13
azonenbergtake stain with it03:13
berndjoh is that how HF removes rust?11:17
berndji always assumed it was some sort of anion substitution + solubility trick11:18
B0101berdj: when was the last time azonenberg messaged on this channel?11:42
berndjB0101: about 8h30m ago13:07
berndjoops, only saw your message an hour after.  make that 10 hours ago13:07
azonenbergberndj: thats just a guess14:01
azonenbergi could be wrong14:01
berndji never thought "rust remover" was something for toilets, either! i assumed it was to get rust off *metal*14:02
azonenbergberndj: this stuff is apparently made for ceramics16:05
azonenbergThey make ones for metal too16:05
azonenbergI have no idea, i've never used it for its intended purpose :p16:05
azonenbergi use it as a cheap source of not-too-concentrated HF16:05
azonenbergswkhan: did you get the wafer?16:05
berndjwhat, did you send it by neutrino beam??16:15
berndjthe only stuff i can find with "rust" in its intended purpose, seems to be based on phosphoric acid.  or just "acid-based", they don't always say WHAT :(16:16
azonenbergberndj: most of the ones meant for metal etc are phosphoric16:30
azonenbergthats why the one HF product on the market was a lucky find16:31
flyback-berndj, it's also nasty shit22:10
flyback-so be careful22:10
berndjwe know by now!22:11
flyback-well I am not taking any chances22:11
flyback-I seen photos22:11
berndjafaik azonenberg has calcium gluconate around Just In Case (tm)22:11
berndj(maybe not calcium?)22:11
berndjwhat have your dealings with HF been?22:12
Action: azonenberg uses a lab coat, norfoil gloves, goggles, and a full face shiedl as well22:13
flyback-just reading22:13
flyback-but about 7-10 yrs ago when I was shopping at walmart and I picked up the bottle of wink22:13
flyback-Ii yelled out "WHAT THE HELL IS THIS?"22:13
berndjbut just imagine, your bones will become birefringent as they turn to fluorspar!22:14
azonenbergflyback-: lol22:14
flyback-it was on the bottome shelf too22:16
flyback-some kid could get into it22:16
azonenbergflyback-: they put denatonium benzoate in it :p22:17
azonenbergby that point its already in your mouth :p22:17
flyback-yeah by the time you tasted it you are fucked already22:17
Last message repeated 3 time(s).22:18
berndjjust how much of 3% HF would you need to be truly screwed?22:44
berndjif that's less than what it takes to let the denatonium benzoate do its job, then yes, bottom shelf is bad22:45
azonenbergberndj: i have no idea22:46
azonenbergi've never so much as splashed a drop on me22:46
azonenbergand i dont plan to try :p22:46
azonenbergi've gotten a drop on my gloves once or twice but always noticed and changed immediately22:46
berndji got the impression that you needed a good splash for it to take (serious) effect22:46
azonenbergberndj: Probably22:46
azonenbergBut i dont like taking chances22:47
azonenberggloves are cheap, fingers arent :p22:47
berndjmakes you wonder how you can use fluoridated toothpaste!22:48
berndj(i'm pretty sure by now that that "stinging" sensation from brushing your teeth is exactly what makes HF so dangerous - only in a small dose)22:48
azonenbergNo, its NaF22:48
berndj(making little fluorspar particles in your cells)22:48
azonenbergand in a tiny volume22:48
azonenberglike 0.01% or so22:49
azonenbergi dont think you ca nfeel it22:49
berndjdunno; at the dentist you get this NaF mouthwash too, same effect22:49
azonenbergyou sure thats not the mint flavor?22:49
azonenbergi cant stand mint22:49
azonenbergi use this silly all-natural childrens fruit flavored toothpaste as its the only non-mint i've found anywhere lol22:50
azonenbergits fluorinated but doesnt seem to have any stinging22:50
berndjhmm, i don't know, but why would that pink dentist's solution also be mintified?22:51
azonenbergpeople are used to mouth-cleaning things being mint flavored22:51
berndjhmm, some random googling reveals "Expect to feel a tingling feeling if you use toothpaste with fluoride in it."  (an article on how to cure acne with toothpaste)22:52
azonenbergswkhan: ping23:41
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